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maybe its actually just a quite ridiculously funny joke

Paulie wrote:

elgato wrote:i wonder what venom's game is. is he sort of a silent party? they all look too young on the myspace?

Dr Venom is the singer. He's 23/24 I think.

They are clearly only doing well because of his contacts - he used to work at 1Xtra.

Naaah, I don't think so. I think its hard graft, buckets of charm, years at rap school and Ivor Novello award-wining lyrics.

Im going to stick pencils in my nostrils and bang my head on the table

what a load of shit

elgato wrote:maybe its just complete, all-encompassing satire. i dont know. he seems quite intelligent. hmm

If it is satire, then fair enough he's clever, I'm a dick. But it's not.

elgato wrote:maybe its actually just a quite ridiculously funny joke

Well their single's hardly serious is it?

Plus it's catchy. Good hooks, nice beats. I might even buy it. I don't really mind him catting jme's flow; it sounds alright and it's in a completely different context. What will be rubbish is when they make it big with this single and then release an album full of samey sounding stuff.

As a one off though, I think it's quality. Just don't take it like they're assaulting your scene, and don't believe the hype.

Paulie wrote: They are clearly only doing well because of his contacts - he used to work at 1Xtra.

that's not true though is it? their single's had 374,480 plays on their myspace and they've been hyped/blogged to fuck for a while. you don't get that 'cos you used to hold down a job on 1xtra and gained 'a few contacts'.

Reminds me of these clowns:

http://www.myspace.com/neosonic

They say they're punk combined with Jungle, but they sound like somebody with a No Doubt fixation and a Gabba loop construction kit.

Peace and fucking.

RE: the nathan barley thing - listen to the lyrics, they're aware of it, and they don't care Neither should you guys.

^^ maybe, but about that and sort of @ TNT re: indie...

i've been involved in indie scenes for short periods at a couple of points in my life. what eventually repulsed me both times (one of the things at least) was the attitude towards musics understood as 'black.' there was always an underlying or explicit disdain that came across either as outright mockery or, more insidiously, as some sort of ironic engagement - e.g. sticking a 'gangsta rap' in the middle of a set. at a certain point it became cool to say you liked public enemy or native tongues or whatever, and i'd think "yeah, i remember you making racist comments to me about those things in high school." so i'm very suspicious anytime something like this pops up where a black/urban/etc. music is colonized by people who use irony to mock the thing they're borrowing and give them the escape hatch of saying "it was all a pisstake, of course we don't like that ghetto stuff." that and the fact that all of these indie-related scenes seem to be allergic to genuine sentiment. irony is a cultural plague.

juliun_c90 wrote:

Paulie wrote: They are clearly only doing well because of his contacts - he used to work at 1Xtra.

that's not true though is it? their single's had 374,480 plays on their myspace and they've been hyped/blogged to fuck for a while. you don't get that 'cos you used to hold down a job on 1xtra and gained 'a few contacts'.

no you get that from a marketing campaign some butt munching wanna be hip music journos still trying to hang onto their youth and a load of twats who believe said journo's words are the gospel

but for it to be funny to me the satire has to go much deeper. to the point where everything about them is satirical, where even the music itself is just a means to satire, as well as the photos, the influences, the clothes, the myspace! otherwise its just lame irony and i find it a bit disgusting

forensix (mcr) wrote: no you get that from a marketing campaign some butt munching wanna be hip music journo's still trying to hang onto their youth and a load of twats who believe said journo's words are the gospel

Name me one band who've made it big solely because they make good music. Doesn't happen. Where does all this aggression come from? I don't understand.

juliun_c90 wrote:

Paulie wrote: They are clearly only doing well because of his contacts - he used to work at 1Xtra.

that's not true though is it? their single's had 374,480 plays on their myspace and they've been hyped/blogged to fuck for a while. you don't get that 'cos you used to hold down a job on 1xtra and gained 'a few contacts'.

This is the last contribution I'm making to this debate, because the success of worthless music just makes me too angry. But do you not think the existance of "contacts" might be quite useful when creating "hype"? I'm not saying the product isn't depressingly marketable. Lots of things are marketable, but the sucessful ones don't just get out there by accident.

Too much time and money is wasted on irony. If it's not genuine, why do it at all?

UFO over easy wrote: Name me one band who've made it big solely because they make good music. Doesn't happen. Where does all this aggression come from? I don't understand.

its not agression; merely my narrow view of NME journos and the sheep who read it

Paulie wrote:

juliun_c90 wrote:

Paulie wrote: They are clearly only doing well because of his contacts - he used to work at 1Xtra.

that's not true though is it? their single's had 374,480 plays on their myspace and they've been hyped/blogged to fuck for a while. you don't get that 'cos you used to hold down a job on 1xtra and gained 'a few contacts'.

This is the last contribution I'm making to this debate, because the success of worthless music just makes me too angry. But do you not think the existance of "contacts" might be quite useful when creating "hype"? I'm not saying the product isn't depressingly marketable. Lots of things are marketable, but the sucessful ones don't just get out there by accident.

of course its going to be useful. i don't think that's the only factor at work here though.

whether some people on this forum can live with the fact or not and regardless of the perceived musical merits of the band, the reality is there are some people out there who like hadouken not because the NME told them to, not because they've been marketed cleverly and not because they're young and have an under-developed musical pallette. it'll be solely because they like their sound.

not @ paulie- there's a lot of sneering and snobbery directed at 'indie' that fucks me off.

UFO over easy wrote:Where does all this aggression come from? I don't understand.

autonomic wrote:what eventually repulsed me both times (one of the things at least) was the attitude towards musics understood as 'black.' there was always an underlying or explicit disdain that came across either as outright mockery or, more insidiously, as some sort of ironic engagement - e.g. sticking a 'gangsta rap' in the middle of a set. at a certain point it became cool to say you liked public enemy or native tongues or whatever, and i'd think "yeah, i remember you making racist comments to me about those things in high school." so i'm very suspicious anytime something like this pops up where a black/urban/etc. music is colonized by people who use irony to mock the thing their borrowing and give them the escape hatch of saying "it was all a pisstake, of course we don't like that ghetto stuff." that and the fact that all of these indie-related scenes seem to be allergic to genuine sentiment. irony is a cultural plague.

and unless they have clocked that, and are playing on that very thing, and thats the essence of what theyre doing, then i find it totally alienating and grim.

and even if it is, nathan barley in a way illegitimises that whole approach to art/satire now, the popular climate is as such that it no longer carries so much value (as it did say when Brass Eye came out)

LEGO HAIRCUTS ARE BETTER THAN YOUR SHITTY HATS!

..and lego haircuts are shit!

DELETE YOUR SPAM!

they say that shit's danceable, only if you have Parkinson's and you accidentally walk into the place at 'dubstep' hour. complete wank.

can i just say the nme is the worst magazine on the market- worse even than heat.

will never forget their reveiw of snoops paid the cost lp and praising the futuristic wordplay using an example from the lyrics to eric b & rakims paid in full which was covered on said lp. Surely everyone knows fish, which is my favourite dish from that tune

Wankers there know nothing about music, just fashion twats trying to hype up shit

forensix (mcr) wrote: its not agression; merely my narrow view of NME journos and the sheep who read it

maybe this is my narrow view of Pitchfork journos, and the sheep who read them.

elgato wrote:but for it to be funny to me the satire has to go much deeper. to the point where everything about them is satirical, where even the music itself is just a means to satire, as well as the photos, the influences, the clothes, the myspace! otherwise its just lame irony and i find it a bit disgusting

It's not just about being funny though. It's just a bit light hearted. If everything about the band was satirical then it really would be nathan barley - they wouldn't be a band anymore, more of an experiment. And that's weak, especially when all you're trying to do is make people dance and smile. And they do, I've seen it.

The line between satire and whatever the alternative is in this case (maybe art?) just isn't as clearcut as you make it seem. Maybe their aims are a bit confused, but I don't see why a band should have to draw up a game plan or anything just to make some music.

Maybe we've all been listening to straight faced music too long.

elgato wrote: and unless they have clocked that, and are playing on that very thing, and thats the essence of what theyre doing, then i find it totally alienating and grim.

and even if it is, nathan barley in a way illegitimises that whole approach to art/satire now, the popular climate is as such that it no longer carries so much value (as it did say when Brass Eye came out)

So you're suggesting what they're doing is racist? That even people enjoying their music is encouraging racism?

Well ok, prove it.