Dubstepforum.com

DefeaterDub wrote:I've been told not to layer kicks unless they are highpassed and lowpassed accordingly... The same person also told me just to use one kick and make it beefy with EQ'ing.

just layer that shit like parfait bro

BombsandBottles wrote:If you are making House/Techno then Vengeance samples should be spot on, no layering necessary unless you wanna like combine the low end of one quick drum with the high end of another via LP and HP filtering on the two different samples.

I don't think op makes this kind of techno or house that you are talking about.

Perej wrote:I've got the goldbaby 808s and i fucking hate them.

I've found 808s in general sound pretty wank.

Sounds more like a personal problem.
Anywho, If I layer I tend to like to use a nice crackley low sorta dusty kick with a punchy higher registered kick drum.
Then I usually give a bit of verb to the crackley one for ambiance and a bit of saturation and/or compression to taste
I would also suggested pitching your drums when laying.

Just use clean samples if possible and try layering them with other drum sounds - that'll definitely work out best for ya

I'm getting on quite well with the vengeance kicks but they sound a bit dub-steppy for my taste. I'm really just looking for good kicks really, everything else is fine. Cheers for the responses.

oh and btw I'm not asking about using samples in general im asking about taking a favourite kick drum from a track on Vinyl or whatever.

Perej wrote: I've got the goldbaby 808s and i fucking hate them.

I've found 808s in general sound pretty wank. The only useable one just sounds like one of my speakers is popping. the 909s are amazing though.

What Goldbaby 808 do you have? There are several (Tape 808, Super Analogue 808.. plus there is the free Cassette 808, as well as the 808 samples included in the When Alien Drum Robots Attack sets) - and to be honest, they are some of the most useful sample sets I have ever purchased.

Perej wrote:Hey guys.

I'm finding it difficult to get really clean weighty drums. At the moment I'm finding layering makes everything a bit messy. Normally it's 2-3 kicks but it takes a while and the result is only marginally better so im probably doing it wrong.

Can I cut out this process by just sampling my favourite kick from a tune? I don't see the drawbacks but presumably you lose quality?

Sometimes a kick sample works on it's own fine. Sometimes you find the right sort of kick but it's lacking a little something, so just look for another sample that has the qualities the others lacking. Or just mess about combining samples and see what happens. You might just want the snappy attack of a 909, or the tail of an 808, so adjust adsr to taste. I often layer a kick sample with a sample i've recorded of an old record to add extra grit. Gives you the ability to add different effects to different sections of the kick. Usually once being happy with the way the kicks are working together i'll use a bus compressor just to gently kiss the peaks which serves as a sort of 'glue' to the sounds. The best thing to do OP is just experiment, just open a project and just jam making some kicks, you might even make something you really like, save it and use it in a tune.

I've left loads of stuff out like with anything production there are endless possibilities. These are just a few things I usually do but it all depends on what type of track it is. My main point in noting some of this stuff down for you is really get thinking about which samples will work together, get used to how different types interact. Just sticking three kicks together, in general will be counter-productive. So give this stuff a try. Also just go on a sample hunt and save the ones you like so you got a folder of all your favourite tings.

If your talking about sampling a kick from a song you like that just depends on your principles really. Like I have no problem taking a kick from some old dirty record but personally I wouldn't sample a kick from someone track from music I actively listen too, that's just me tho I'd rather it be my own.

Layering kicks: listen for phasing, check correlation, try working in mono (i've noticed many stereo kicks, if summed on a mono system, they can lose body/weight), if you are losing something by layering, you can try shifting by a few samples to see if that helps. Ideal scenario would be get the right sound from the start without layers, but that's a separate task in its self

BombsandBottles wrote:

ehbrums1 wrote:tbh i find 100 hz kicks to be pretty weak...for me, 60-80 is the sweet spot

I agree, 80hz is the go to THUD freq. if producing Bro Step or Neurofunk something hard like that. Vengeance samples will get you there.

If your going Burial status however, those really poppy 100hz kicks are the way to go. Goldbaby samples are the right choice for that route.

Disagree. Listen to a 100 hz peak kick on a club system. BOOM! That punches right through your chest, definitely not poppy. 60-80 hz could work for a kick, but it'll more often than not interfere with your sub in brostep.

SpookySpaceKook wrote:

BombsandBottles wrote:

ehbrums1 wrote:tbh i find 100 hz kicks to be pretty weak...for me, 60-80 is the sweet spot

I agree, 80hz is the go to THUD freq. if producing Bro Step or Neurofunk something hard like that. Vengeance samples will get you there.

If your going Burial status however, those really poppy 100hz kicks are the way to go. Goldbaby samples are the right choice for that route.

Disagree. Listen to a 100 hz peak kick on a club system. BOOM! That punches right through your chest, definitely not poppy. 60-80 hz could work for a kick, but it'll more often than not interfere with your sub in brostep.

If the power of a sub is 40-50, and a sine has no harmonics, how could a kick at 60 hz interfere with it, regardless of what style it is

ehbrums1 wrote:

SpookySpaceKook wrote:

BombsandBottles wrote:

ehbrums1 wrote:tbh i find 100 hz kicks to be pretty weak...for me, 60-80 is the sweet spot

I agree, 80hz is the go to THUD freq. if producing Bro Step or Neurofunk something hard like that. Vengeance samples will get you there.

If your going Burial status however, those really poppy 100hz kicks are the way to go. Goldbaby samples are the right choice for that route.

Disagree. Listen to a 100 hz peak kick on a club system. BOOM! That punches right through your chest, definitely not poppy. 60-80 hz could work for a kick, but it'll more often than not interfere with your sub in brostep.

If the power of a sub is 40-50, and a sine has no harmonics, how could a kick at 60 hz interfere with it, regardless of what style it is

Then obviously not, but most brostep tunes have sub notes up to 60 hz and above. Subs hitting at 70-80 are (sadly?) not uncommon in brostep, that's why I mentioned the genre name. But if you have a brostep tune with a sine sub hitting 40-50, then obv it's perfectly OK to have a 60-70 hz kick.

Well then it's down to shitty producers not shitty techniques

Mad EP wrote:

Perej wrote: I've got the goldbaby 808s and i fucking hate them.

I've found 808s in general sound pretty wank. The only useable one just sounds like one of my speakers is popping. the 909s are amazing though.

What Goldbaby 808 do you have? There are several (Tape 808, Super Analogue 808.. plus there is the free Cassette 808, as well as the 808 samples included in the When Alien Drum Robots Attack sets) - and to be honest, they are some of the most useful sample sets I have ever purchased.

Tape 808.

I just don't find them useful for anything. The hats sound weak and thin, alot of the snares have frequencies I don't want on them and the kicks either sound overly subby or sound like a pop with no weight on them at all. I can never get them to sound how I want.

It's not that Goldbaby 808's are bad in particular it's just that I've personally found 808's are useless. I never ever find a worthwhile use for an 808 kick because even if I sidechain it it doesn't work effectively with a bassline. I'll take a 909 any day. The click on an 808 kick sounds awful.

Though having said all that, if this is an 808 kick I will shut up and use them because this kind of kick is what I'm aiming for.

Fair enough - there are tons I don't use in that set... but also plenty I do: especially the saturated long booms.

Perej wrote:
Though having said all that, if this is an 808 kick I will shut up and use them because this kind of kick is what I'm aiming for.

That is not an 808 kick, sounds like its at least two other samples layered.