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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:32 am
by pk-
where/when did he say that? :o

bit offkey really isnt it

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:34 am
by dubluke
very offkey if you ask me, its that kind of talk that incites others to racism, and the spreading of that bullshit is never a good thing

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:34 am
by parson

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:35 am
by parson
kucinich is the only democratic candidate that voted against the war in iraq, voted against homeland security, wants to impeach cheney, and isn't for the north american union.

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:37 am
by parson

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:37 am
by FSTZ
I am seriously banking on a Stewart / Colbert ticket

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:38 am
by FSTZ

people think I am crazy when I tell them this

stupid intercontinental highway

stupid Amero

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:39 am
by pk-
If you have not read the news in a few months, you may be unaware: there are plans to create a North American Union, whereby Mexico, the United States and Canada will eventually become a single country, with a single currency and a single superhighway system
what the fuck? really?

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:39 am
by drquynh
Parson wrote:
Ron Paul wrote:Indeed, it is shocking to consider the uniformity of opinion among blacks in this country. Opinion polls consistently show that only about 5% of blacks have sensible political opinions, i.e. support the free market, individual liberty, and the end of welfare and affirmative action.... Given the inefficiencies of what D.C. laughingly calls the "criminal justice system," I think we can safely assume that 95% of the black males in that city are semi-criminal or entirely criminal.

If similar in-depth studies were conducted in other major cities, who doubts that similar results would be produced? We are constantly told that it is evil to be afraid of black men, but it is hardly irrational. Black men commit murders, rapes, robberies, muggings, and burglaries all out of proportion to their numbers."
Ron Paul didn't write that. That was mis-quoted as being him... here is what he ACTUALLY SAYS about racism...
What Really Divides Us?

by Rep. Ron Paul, MD


The overwhelming media response to recent remarks by Senator Trent Lott shows that the nation remains incredibly sensitive about matters of race, despite the outward progress of the last 40 years. A nation that once prided itself on a sense of rugged individualism has become uncomfortably obsessed with racial group identities.

In the aftermath of the Lott debacle, we must not allow the term "states’ rights" to be smeared and distorted into code words for segregationist policies or racism. States’ rights simply means the individual states should retain authority over all matters not expressly delegated to the federal government in Article I of the Constitution. Most of the worst excesses of big government can be traced to a disregard for states’ rights, which means a disregard for the Ninth and Tenth amendments. The real reason liberals hate the concept of states’ right has nothing to do with racism, but rather reflects a hostility toward anything that would act as a limit on the power of the federal government.

Yet it is the federal government more than anything else that divides us along race, class, religion, and gender lines. The federal government, through its taxes, restrictive regulations, corporate subsidies, racial set-asides, and welfare programs, plays far too large a role in determining who succeeds and who fails in our society. This government "benevolence" crowds out genuine goodwill between men by institutionalizing group thinking, thus making each group suspicious that others are receiving more of the government loot. Americans know that factors other than merit in the free market often play a part in the success of some, and this leads to resentment and hostility between us.

Still, the left argues that stringent federal laws are needed to combat racism, always implying of course that southern states are full of bigoted rednecks who would oppress minorities if not for the watchful eye of Washington. They ignore, however, the incredible divisiveness created by their collectivist big-government policies.

Racism is simply an ugly form of collectivism, the mindset that views humans only as members of groups and never as individuals. Racists believe that all individual who share superficial physical characteristics are alike; as collectivists, racists think only in terms of groups. By encouraging Americans to adopt a group mentality, the advocates of so-called "diversity" actually perpetuate racism. Their intense focus on race is inherently racist, because it views individuals only as members of racial groups.

Conservatives and libertarians should fight back and challenge the myth that collectivist liberals care more about racism. Modern liberalism, however well intentioned, is a byproduct of the same collectivist thinking that characterizes racism. The continued insistence on group thinking only inflames racial tensions.

The true antidote to racism is liberty. Liberty means having a limited, constitutional government devoted to the protection of individual rights rather than group claims. Liberty means free-market capitalism, which rewards individual achievement and competence, not skin color, gender, or ethnicity. In a free market, businesses that discriminate lose customers, goodwill, and valuable employees – while rational businesses flourish by choosing the most qualified employees and selling to all willing buyers. More importantly, in a free society every citizen gains a sense of himself as an individual, rather than developing a group or victim mentality. This leads to a sense of individual responsibility and personal pride, making skin color irrelevant. Rather than looking to government to correct what is essentially a sin of the heart, we should understand that reducing racism requires a shift from group thinking to an emphasis on individualism.

December 24, 2002

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:40 am
by parson
pk- wrote:
If you have not read the news in a few months, you may be unaware: there are plans to create a North American Union, whereby Mexico, the United States and Canada will eventually become a single country, with a single currency and a single superhighway system
what the fuck? really?
its all being done in secret and its all very real.

and assholes like obama and hillary are all for it.

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:42 am
by parson
ron paul is kind of a piece of shit but he's my second choice behind kucinich

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:48 am
by umkhontowesizwe
DrQuynh wrote:Ron Paul didn't write that. That was mis-quoted as being him... here is what he ACTUALLY SAYS about racism...
Even if it wasn't written by him, if he didn't agree with it, why would he allow it to appear in his newsletter?

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:48 am
by pk-
The North American Union (abbreviated NAU) is a theoretical continental union of Canada, Mexico and the United States similar in structure to the European Union, including a common currency sometimes called the amero.
ah right...that's not really one country as such, is it.

would that not have economic benefits for all three of you?

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:49 am
by parson
ok, mark pk as pro north american union

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:50 am
by parson
if this was so beneficial to us it wouldn't need to be carried out in secret by the most evil people in the world.

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:54 am
by pk-
nah lol i'm just wondering...i don't mean it necessarily is a good thing, just wondering why you (by which i mean the majority of the US, by the sounds of what i've just been reading) think it isn't

i thought generally being part of the EU benefited its members

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:55 am
by masstronaut
It's about further consolidation and centralisation of power. This is not a good thing and it is not for our benefit. Of economic benefit to the people would be for governments and bankers to stop robbing them of all their wealth. Yeah, I think that would be beneficial.

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:59 am
by masstronaut
By the way I think it will be fascinating (for us in the UK at least) to get Mos Dan's reports on how this 'election' plays out. Shame Padraig didn't agree eh Dan? ;)

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:04 am
by drquynh
Parson wrote:
pk- wrote:
If you have not read the news in a few months, you may be unaware: there are plans to create a North American Union, whereby Mexico, the United States and Canada will eventually become a single country, with a single currency and a single superhighway system
what the fuck? really?
its all being done in secret and its all very real.

and assholes like obama and hillary are all for it.
We can agree there... but if Ron Paul is so bad, you should read what your fellow Kucinich supporters were saying about him last night in New Hampshire... and you should also know that Dennis chose him as a running mate, should he win.. and his wife also said she'd vote for Ron Paul if Kucinich wasn't the nominee of his party... and with that:
DISCAIMER: The events described below contain vivid acts of Ron Paul supporters and Dennis Kucinich supporters working together to achieve a nearly magical event. It is also not proofread as I am too tired to do so. If you do not like this, read no further. That is all.

I was at the event(s) in Nashua/Manchester Sunday! It was AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!

I am very good at estimating crowds (I used to have to do it at minor league baseball
games), and we easily had 450 people out there rallying for Paul.

We taunted Sean Hannity AND Frank Luntz outside their restaurant.

This is how it started - it was magical - I was there from minute one:

Dr. Paul had finished speaking at the Free State Project meeting in Nashua, and that got out about 2pm. He said "There is nothing in the Constitution that says that I have to enforce unconstiutional law." He also called out McCain on the hundred years war thing. After what was probably his fourth major round of applause in three minutes at the beginning of his speech, he said "Wow. What an easy crowd." and laughed. It was great.

We had scheduled a rally outside the hotel where he spoke after his speech. Well, first Barry Goldwater Jr. came out to chat with all of us, but Dr. Paul came out as well (I'll have the YouTube up tomorrow) and greeted people and shook hands. He stopped to talk to this tiny, tiny girl who was like 2 years old, but Dr. Paul squatted down to talk to her for a minute or so. He stands up and turns around to leave, and this adorable little girl says "Bwye, Won Pwaullll..." AAAAAAAAAAwwwwwwwwwwwwww............. cutest thing I have ever seen.

So, Jim Forsythe asks us to all travel to Manchester to the studio where Dr. Paul was taping his town hall. OK, fine. We head up. Get there, there's about 70-80 of us outside the studio. Dr. Paul's truck came in, he waves at all of us on the way in. We are all waving at cars, many are beeping, etc. But, not much in the way of media and the traffic there is not great (like maybe one car per 40 seconds, it's not the busiest street in the city), and then some people left to watch Ron on CCTV. Maybe 50 of us left.

THEN word comes down that on Elm St. (one of Manchester's busiest streets with dozens of cars on every block on it at all times, about three blocks from where we were), there are "about 50" mixed supporters for Hillary, et al., and guess what? "C-Span and ABC are up there filming them."

What to do? What to do? Official campaign wants us to stay here, but we hear there's C-Span and ABC filming three blocks up... AND we can outshow Hill (at least by a bit) on a stupidly busy intersection in NH’s largest intersection at rush hour...

MARCH ON ELM. STREET!!!

OK, so we get to the intersection, and we are already outnumbering everyone else put together, but not by a lot. Obama and Kucinich fighting for second most popular. Hill in 4th.

Maybe 120 people total now, 70 us, at all four corners. Now, we NH folk are very friendly with each other, say hello when we are rallying for different candidates, etc. Heck, politics is basically friendly small talk around here - in mornings in stores, it's the default topic of conversation. Well this is when it got a little weird for the first time. First, a 20ish year-old Hillary supporter goes by and says to me and a couple other people out of the blue as she’s walking by: “I don’t know how you can support somebody who is so OBVIOUSLY going to lose.” I don’t know what came out of me, but I said “Better than a corporate shill.” J Then, some people from Mass. (Rudy/McCain folk) came by and said something like “I know Ron Paul thinks Israel is the worst thing ever, but…” the guy was a hothead, but the woman was more reasonable and open, there were a couple raised voices (but not much) when the Mass. Guy got into it with a guy from Illinois. FUNNY thing though – one of the guys on our side who they decided to question was not only Jewish, but he described himself as a “big-time Zionist” and he had spent a bunch of time in the Middle East and when she quizzed him on it, he got every answer right about the area and culture exactly right, right away. The woman and I kept talking for a bit, more in-depth and respectfully (but don’t worry, I was waving a RP sign the whole time). J Now there are around 200 of us, and maybe 160 are Ron supporters. Nice.

The call comes out! C-Span and ABC filming at Elm St. and Merrimack St.!
MARCH ON MERRIMACK STREET!!!

So most of us went there, a healthy contingent stayed behind (more Obama people showed up there), and when we got there, guess what! Like another 180 there already – PLUS C-Span and Boston ABC. We all are doing chants, My favs were “Don’t tax me, bro!” – there was a large sign saying the same thing – and “Live Free or Die.” – That got the most honking support by far!

No kidding – we had like 300 chanting people rallying, holding signs, cars blaring their horns, on one intersection. We were also right at Dennis Kucinich HQ, so there’s like 40 of them out.

We got into some serious anti-war chants together, “Support the Troops – Bring them Home!”

“Sean Hannity is here! He’s eating at the Merrimack restaurant.” (where we were right at)…

“FOX NEWS SUCKS! FOX NEWS SUCKS!”

Now the crowds are getting larger, maybe 400 total, 350 RP people, more signs than any human could count. Huge signs - 15, 20' long - lots of 'em - a flashing red and green RP sign made with Christmas lights, all kinds of stuff.

I walked back to the first intersection (Elm and Bridge St.), and lo and behold, now we are back up to another 90 people or so there, maybe 35 others (20 Obama?). Chants are really heavy now- “TROOPS HOME NOW!” – of course we got in a few “Don’t tax me, bro”s! J

I walk back. My God, it’s grown larger. Not just us, but Denny too. Now we probably have 400 on our own, plus probably more than 80 of DKs people. The first police show up. OK, they’re just trying to get people to stay on the sidewalk. I know NH law pretty well, I’m listening closely. The cops are being reasonable, and staying exactly legal, not pushing their borders.

Until… They tried telling us that they not only meant on the sidewalk, but back from the curb. One young woman says “What do you mean? That’s still the sidewalk!” Cops back down.

“Frank Luntz is in the restaurant now!”

“PULL FOX’S LICENSE!” went the chant.

More cops show up. At this point, all I can think is that there is NO WAY any meetup groups, or the campaign could have pulled off such a strong showing of supporters with literally no notice. Only one thing could be happening – people are joining us spontaneously. People are driving by (and I mean a LOT of people, waving Ron Paul signs from their cars.

The DK bus kept driving up and down the street beeping their horns in support of us, the RP people and the DK people coming out strongly against the war. The Mitt Romney bus drives by twice and gets soundly booed each time.

Then the strangest moment happened – don’t read too much into this, because it never became really pronounced, but I notices that as the cops are trying to keep people on the sidewalks are forming a “7” formation (there were only 4 of them in our corner). Makes sense. But then, they are backing up more and more, and two 20ish women (don’t you LOVE the girls in our movement???) start waving these HUGE American flags between us and the police and we all start chanting “Live Free or Die!” – they close in a bit more (like another step) as I am looking at them. And what I believe were the ABC cameras turn towards our group. I look at the cameras for like 3-4 seconds, and then I turned to look back at the police (visions of Chicago ’68 film in my head), and they were gone. For some reasons unbeknownst to me, they decided not to push their way through waving flags in order to get past two unarmed girls in order to push a crowd chanting “Live Free or Die” in front of a national network’s TV camera. (“The whole world is watching!”)

The chant for a short while turns to “Right to Revolution!” which is guaranteed in the NH Constitution.

OK, now comes rumor that FOX has shown up, and is running a taping of a show at the Radisson a couple blocks down.

MARCH ON THE RADISSON!!!

Now the police have decided that they are only going to let people walk across the street when the signal is saying walk. Maybe it was good because of the numbers, but I still think we would have found a way.

We get behind the people taping and chant “Revoke Fox’s License” – Remember, we are still way dominant in the crowd, but we have a healthy Kucinish minority. Then we went to some anti-tax chant without Dennis' people and the Kucinich people did some chant w/o us, then, IIRC, we joined in “Live Free or Die.”

That’s when I left, I was tired and cold and had been Ron Pauling all day.

It was really an astounding day. The magic is in the air.

Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:05 am
by parson
yeah i already said he's my number 2 choice

doesn't mean i can't be critical of him