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Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 8:11 pm
by misk
thesis wrote:I'm doing 'live' dubstep. Heres my methods...
When I first attempted this, I was breaking up my tunes into 8 channels of audio, loading into Live and controlling with a Zero SL, adding FX etc. Found that method too complicated (8 streams of audio to look after!), and also very hard to mix into the next tune - how do you mix 8 channels of one tune, to 8 channels of something else? More trouble than its worth (punters don't know the difference), and more things to go wrong. It was also a bitch to prepare the WAV files, sometimes more work than the production of the tune itself!
Now I'm splitting my tunes into 3 channels: beats/percussion/fx (depending on the tune). In Live I'm running 4 channels of audio. Channels 1 and 2 are the 'decks' containing the beats. I play 1 and 2 like a normal DJ set, then layer the other stuff on top. Each channel has an EQ, and a delay/reverb on the sends. All controls are mapped to Zero SL, so I don't have to touch the laptop once during a set.
I usually extend the layered elements, so you have parts from one track mixed in with another. For most tracks I also add extra stuff which is not in the original, such as vocal samples, extra percussion. So when you hear me play live, it sounds different from the original versions. I don't see the point in playing your tunes in Ableton just as a straight DJ set... might as well just play a mix CD. Adding this extra stuff also keeps me busy when I'm not mixing - ie. the crowd can see I'm actually doing something and not just staring at the screen - which I think should be avoided at all costs.
In the future I'm looking at adding some MIDI percussion to the mix... maybe playing a Roland Handsonic or something.
interesting. Not looking at a screen is the main reason im using hardware. i'd love to hear some of these live sets.
Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 8:27 pm
by r
well youve to control ableton a bit better i do the same thing with the 8 audio tracks.. and it works fine with me. True its hard but when you can control it really you well, you can really 'jam' and make 'new' tracks with your samples you've loaded into your channels.
its practice practice practice. In the minimal scene its really populair this way
Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 10:33 pm
by spencertron
so, i introduced this into a gig i did this evening (i did rehearse it mind you)...it worked out great. much in the same way as i did with live improv breakcore etc in reaktor (except less fast and glitchy obviously.) more to come...i'll record a set and post it up sometime in the near future.
Edit: it wasn't quite the crowd for it though, i was supporting these jokers
http://www.myspace.com/iamx bunch o weirdo's. after my set, some chap asked me "what do you call that" i told him it was northern afrobeat
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 12:24 am
by drifterman_
haha spencer did u do a dstep set?
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 8:04 am
by misk
spencerTron wrote:
Edit: it wasn't quite the crowd for it though, i was supporting these jokers
http://www.myspace.com/iamx bunch o weirdo's. after my set, some chap asked me "what do you call that" i told him it was northern afrobeat
northern afrobeat? love it! I definitely understand what you mean by "not the right crowd". its rather shocking for your average dancer, when they see that your not doing things the way everyone else does. they dont know what to make of it.
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 3:46 pm
by wagawaga
im part of a live act which isnt strictly speaking dubstep, we usually start off in the low bpm's 120-130 playing nice acid melodies and speed up through breakbeat-dnb and up into grimey breakcore.
our setup is 2 pc's running reaktor, using synths and step sequencers. these are both either sampled into a 3rd homegrown reaktor live tool and fed directly through so they so we can edit filters/fx ourselves. over the top of that backing we have a vocalist messing about on a kaosspad.
its quite frantic at times, but the end result is pretty stunning. and of course the best thing is that we dont have to have anything pre-rehearsed. just turn up and start writing
myself ive started playing live dubstep with a drummer friend of mine. still early days. as yet i play tracks from the laptop and he rips over the top.
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 5:35 pm
by twitch
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 5:38 pm
by cursedc
I used to do a pure laptop set.....got away from that and now i just transfer the files to my SP-555 sampler for all my beats/improve FX/melody synths samples and then my bass in managed by my SH-201. I occasionally sing/MC so I use the sampler's input and effect my vox with the mix. I usually tear down the place, people really don't know how to take me.
I'm also thrashing about with weapons and costumes. I'm a bit more occultish looking live, folks tend to be creeped out by that.
Posted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:50 pm
by spencertron
drifterman_ wrote:haha spencer did u do a dstep set?
not completely, it was breakcore (175-200bpm!) and about 10 minutes of improv dubstep, ...i decided that this is it for me after last night
i'm currently in the process of reprogramming my patch to accommodate for totally improv dupstep. it's been quite good these past couple of days working stuff out for this, i think i'm done with improv beats/breaks/breakcore.
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:06 pm
by upreal
What? This will stay on the top of my ladder of awesomeness for a long time.
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 2:15 pm
by upreal
I hope you dont mind me asking in this thread but : what is all the stuff you need if you want to dj from a laptop?
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:23 pm
by thinking
you need to see Elemental playing live - he is a wizard on Ableton and a sick sick producer to boot.
he uses loops from his own productions and recombines them incl FX and so on.
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:53 pm
by cursedc
upreal wrote:I hope you dont mind me asking in this thread but : what is all the stuff you need if you want to dj from a laptop?
an audio/midi interface or a midi/usb controller with a built in audio interface usually work fine. Ableton Live, Logic, Cubase, FL7, whatever DAW/music track player you want to run. Assign knobs, fuck shit up.
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 8:41 pm
by misk
ThinKing wrote:you need to see Elemental playing live - he is a wizard on Ableton and a sick sick producer to boot.
he uses loops from his own productions and recombines them incl FX and so on.
being on the other side of the pond, is there anywhere online i can check out his sets? any videos, etc?
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 8:46 pm
by misk
oh yeah, also, what ed solo does with the korg there, i pretty much do with my electribes. but without a computer. i dont have two djs feeding me samples either... any takers?
Posted: Fri Mar 28, 2008 10:06 pm
by cursedc
I use my own home made samples with a sp-555, all the bass/freakout synths stuff with my SH-32 and SH-201. No laptops allowed!
I used to use laptops for live shows, but I found hardware does a better job for me. I can afford to have my sampler break versus my Laptop breaking. 500 bucks versus 2000 bucks...easy choice there.
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:05 am
by suitcasepimp
does this really count as live though??
At end of the day this is just dub to heart, a perfect live dubstep performace surely would have instruments?? drummer, percussionist, bass player and some synths, this would need a hefty collaboration and quite a bit of practice obviously... its what I'm working on at moment though.
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:19 am
by spencertron
suitcasepimp wrote:does this really count as live though??
At end of the day this is just dub to heart, a perfect live dubstep performace surely would have instruments?? drummer, percussionist, bass player and some synths, this would need a hefty collaboration and quite a bit of practice obviously... its what I'm working on at moment though.
yes...dunno...
i recorded a 2 minute 'live' jam/proof of concept...with the tools i use for live improv breakcore in reaktor, below is one of them...
improv_dubstep.mp3 - 4.47MB
bare in mind that this is a little rough and just a test, i got trigger happy with the live beat chopping and i think i need to quantize any input i make into my qwerty controller...but i'm just toying with idea's, sound generators, sequenced synths and exsisting sounds i've made aswell...but i recorded this live just a minute ago.
ps my pissing about might be a bit glitchy for some
BLU by clist (a product of the reaktor users community project based on the works by Tim Shaw (exile) i've been working/using this a great deal and still modifying it for my purposes...there's alot more to add and there's a couple of reaktor synths aswell, but this is the guts of where it happens, ...i'm currently writing a user manual for this patch, but this is my own version so far.
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:49 am
by misk
spencerTron wrote:suitcasepimp wrote:does this really count as live though??
At end of the day this is just dub to heart, a perfect live dubstep performace surely would have instruments?? drummer, percussionist, bass player and some synths, this would need a hefty collaboration and quite a bit of practice obviously... its what I'm working on at moment though.
yes...dunno...
i recorded a 2 minute 'live' jam/proof of concept...with the tools i use for live improv breakcore in reaktor, below is one of them...
improv_dubstep.mp3 - 4.47MB
bare in mind that this is a little rough and just a test, i got trigger happy with the live beat chopping and i think i need to quantize any input i make into my qwerty controller...but i'm just toying with idea's, sound generators, sequenced synths and exsisting sounds i've made aswell...but i recorded this live just a minute ago.
ps my pissing about might be a bit glitchy for some
BLU by clist (a product of the reaktor users community project based on the works by Tim Shaw (exile) i've been working/using this a great deal and still modifying it for my purposes...there's alot more to add and there's a couple of reaktor synths aswell, but this is the guts of where it happens, ...i'm currently writing a user manual for this patch, but this is my own version so far.
spencer, if i saw you doing this live, id hate it. Id hate on you, because i was jealous of you. this is badass. i'd love to hear more of this. in the meantime, i'll have to get a more recent live set together. Love the glitchiness man!
Posted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:50 am
by misk
oh, and i know clist. he and rachmiel are secret heroes of mine