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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2009 10:10 pm
by missedthebus
Everyone should read this book (well really three books in a book):
Micheal Hardt and Antonio Negri - Empire.
Here is a link to a full .pdf:
http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/negri/ ... ntable.pdf
Then assess your ideological political leaning once having read the book.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 1:09 am
by phase 2
Lui wrote:I'm anti-stupidfuck. I know that sounds like smartass forum bullshit, but philosophically, being anti-stupidfuck actually solves everything. Pure socialist states are just as evil as pure corporate ones. Capitalism does a lot of harm, but it can't be abandoned completely in a material world. Just don't be a stupid fuck and you are setting the right political example for the world. Oppress people? No don't be a stupid fuck! Steal and invade? No don't be a stupid fuck! Cook meth and crack and pump it into ghettos? Rape and destroy people and the environment? Use your corporate power to create wars for profit. I mean its actually obvious right? The answer is simply no don't be a stupid fuck!
Agreed.
I can't be doing with the anti-capitalist crowd. Just a load of complainers with no workable solutions/alternatives. Bored middle-class kids, innit.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 7:23 am
by kins83
Phase 2 wrote:Lui wrote:I'm anti-stupidfuck. I know that sounds like smartass forum bullshit, but philosophically, being anti-stupidfuck actually solves everything. Pure socialist states are just as evil as pure corporate ones. Capitalism does a lot of harm, but it can't be abandoned completely in a material world. Just don't be a stupid fuck and you are setting the right political example for the world. Oppress people? No don't be a stupid fuck! Steal and invade? No don't be a stupid fuck! Cook meth and crack and pump it into ghettos? Rape and destroy people and the environment? Use your corporate power to create wars for profit. I mean its actually obvious right? The answer is simply no don't be a stupid fuck!
Agreed.
I can't be doing with the anti-capitalist crowd. Just a load of complainers with no workable solutions/alternatives. Bored middle-class kids, innit.
I like you two.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 7:46 am
by tr0tsky
Phase 2 wrote:Lui wrote:I'm anti-stupidfuck. I know that sounds like smartass forum bullshit, but philosophically, being anti-stupidfuck actually solves everything. Pure socialist states are just as evil as pure corporate ones. Capitalism does a lot of harm, but it can't be abandoned completely in a material world. Just don't be a stupid fuck and you are setting the right political example for the world. Oppress people? No don't be a stupid fuck! Steal and invade? No don't be a stupid fuck! Cook meth and crack and pump it into ghettos? Rape and destroy people and the environment? Use your corporate power to create wars for profit. I mean its actually obvious right? The answer is simply no don't be a stupid fuck!
Agreed.
I can't be doing with the anti-capitalist crowd. Just a load of complainers with no workable solutions/alternatives. Bored middle-class kids, innit.
That's bollocks.
Anyway, I'm an anti-capitalist and a revolutionary socialist.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:32 am
by 45 inches
hurlingdervish wrote:yes im anti-capatalism and socialism
idealists never win
they create horrible futures like brave new world
have to look at what fits NOW and go from there
couldn't agree with you more, not everyone can accept an ideology so ideological and idealistic regimes need to use terror to implement their views on people. but yes, I think capitalism needs to highly regulated to stop raging inequalities and boom/bust economies.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 2:47 pm
by adikt
Phase 2 wrote:Lui wrote:I'm anti-stupidfuck. I know that sounds like smartass forum bullshit, but philosophically, being anti-stupidfuck actually solves everything. Pure socialist states are just as evil as pure corporate ones. Capitalism does a lot of harm, but it can't be abandoned completely in a material world. Just don't be a stupid fuck and you are setting the right political example for the world. Oppress people? No don't be a stupid fuck! Steal and invade? No don't be a stupid fuck! Cook meth and crack and pump it into ghettos? Rape and destroy people and the environment? Use your corporate power to create wars for profit. I mean its actually obvious right? The answer is simply no don't be a stupid fuck!
Agreed.
I can't be doing with the anti-capitalist crowd. Just a load of complainers with no workable solutions/alternatives. Bored middle-class kids, innit.
Lui i agree with completely...Phase 2 i certainly do NOT. Of course there are the bored middle class kids that are anti-capitalist. But as with everything...its fucking stupid to generalize to saying that applies to all anti-capitalists. I've met fucking rich people that are smart enough to realize humanity should not be a cut-throat game of Monopoly!
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 2:57 pm
by reverend dale
I am upper middle class WASP tory you tax dodging commie fucks.
tr0tsky wrote:
Anyway, I'm an anti-capitalist and a revolutionary socialist.
Tanky
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:00 pm
by nousd
Committed anti narco-syndicalist,
evolving pragmatic realist,
occasionally wellandtrulypist
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 3:15 pm
by karmacazee
Black Mass: Apocalyptic Religion and the Death of Utopia by John Gray is an astoundingly good read. Just try not to shout out "fucking bastards!" when you're on a train full of commuters whilst reading it (it will make you want to do that...)
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 4:09 pm
by hurlingdervish
thank god no one has suggested reading Ayn Rand.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:05 pm
by feral witchchild
Anyone who still thinks communism and/or socialism in general could somehow work in this day and age...or in any day and age considering the woeful fucking FAILURES of all the nations who have tried it is a fucking idiot.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 6:37 pm
by limb
Feral Witchchild wrote:Anyone who still thinks communism and/or socialism in general could somehow work in this day and age...or in any day and age considering the woeful fucking FAILURES of all the nations who have tried it is a fucking idiot.
Cuba?
Or Hugo Chavez in Venezuela
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 7:43 pm
by reverend dale
limb wrote:
Cuba?
Or Hugo Chavez in Venezuela
It's better to ask why capitalism works and to provide examples... you'll get a typical westerncentric white rich man's answer.
"What's the most dangerous thing in America?"
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 8:31 pm
by hurlingdervish
before the crazies come out....
ill beat em to it
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:09 pm
by p.t.b.d
hurlingdervish wrote:before the crazies come out....
ill beat em to it
lolwut
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:40 pm
by the acid never lies
Lui wrote:Pure socialist states are just as evil as pure corporate ones.
Wrong. We have never had a 'pure' socialist state - at least not how Marx envisaged.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:52 pm
by cosmic_surgeon
I'd consider myself anti-capitalist, but I am also religously, ideologically, politically agnostic - I try not to follow dogma, ideas are all relative to me and so as someone else posted, I don't like to label.
The thing that drives my reasoning is the idea that society reflects us as a people. I believe political and economic systems are merely the branches, not the root of error. They are, in my eyes at least, the manifestation of the current state of our psyche and thus it does not to do to try and change the world before we change ourselves.
Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:55 pm
by the acid never lies
Cosmic Surgeon wrote:The thing that drives my reasoning is the idea that society reflects us as a people. I believe political and economic systems are merely the branches, not the root of error. They are, in my eyes at least, the manifestation of the current state of our psyche and thus it does not to do to try and change the world before we change ourselves.
Interesting insight - never seen it put quite like that