Dubstepforum.com

^^^

collige wrote:The GOP honestly has no chance of putting up anyone that can stand up to Obama in an election. That said, no one on either side is really "good".

never underestimate the gay marriage, condoms, and religious card.

The GOP is starting to show its hand a bit already

I'm betting the second any of that stuff starts creeping out, most of the moderates are gonna start flying over to the Obama camp, not to mention everyone who's gonna vote for Obama when Ron Paul doesn't get the nomination.

Also

pkay wrote: This is how bush beat gore

collige wrote:I'm betting the second any of that stuff starts creeping out, most of the moderates are gonna start flying over to the Obama camp, not to mention everyone who's gonna vote for Obama when Ron Paul doesn't get the nomination.

Also

pkay wrote: This is how bush beat gore

gay marriage is how bush beat gore... and if you're going to say bush didn't win FL, 2 years ago they finally came out and said Bush did win FL. So that argument is dead. Infact Gore's recount he ordered ended up having bush by about 500

Anywho... my point is don't underestimate the republicans ability to rally the evangelical base. Underestimating that religious base is how bush was elected, twice.

Even if the moderates flock to Obama, there are still a large amount of evangelicals who blindly vote the way their pastors tell them to on sundays. The republicans are going to do their damnedest to make this a religious/morality election as its the ONLY way they'll win.

Pkay is spot on.

pkay wrote:

collige wrote:I'm betting the second any of that stuff starts creeping out, most of the moderates are gonna start flying over to the Obama camp, not to mention everyone who's gonna vote for Obama when Ron Paul doesn't get the nomination.

Also

pkay wrote: This is how bush beat gore

gay marriage is how bush beat gore... and if you're going to say bush didn't win FL, 2 years ago they finally came out and said Bush did win FL. So that argument is dead. Infact Gore's recount he ordered ended up having bush by about 500

Anywho... my point is don't underestimate the republicans ability to rally the evangelical base. Underestimating that religious base is how bush was elected, twice.

Even if the moderates flock to Obama, there are still a large amount of evangelicals who blindly vote the way their pastors tell them to on sundays. The republicans are going to do their damnedest to make this a religious/morality election as its the ONLY way they'll win.

Yes, the Republicans are going to try to make it about religion and there are sure to be plenty of people who vote accordingly. I agree with that. But Obama has the lower middle class on lock. The Democrats have done a decent job at painting the Republicans as the party for the rich, and because of this the republicans have struggled to rally this base. And just like there's no shortage of people who vote blindly the way their pastor tells, there's no shortage of people who'll vote for obama because he's the "people's" president. I can't tell you how many callers I heard on Cspan radio the other day calling in and saying "I know the stimulous package worked because he gave money to the people". Back to the republicans though, Romney is the most electable and the only one that stands a chance. Sure there's a lot of evangelicals that will vote for Santorum, but there's also a lot of other Republicans who just aren't so sure of how he's voted in the past. And more likely than not, if Romney does win the primary, He's going to try to start shifting to the left to make himself seem more moderate. Either way, IMO the only thing the Republicans are going to have to stand on is the soaring gas prices (not saying Obama is to blame, but people like an easy scapegoat). The economy IS picking up and if that continues, Obamas approval rating will pick up as well. I'm not saying this election won't be close, but unless they reveal some sort of scandal on Obama, I think he's going to win. Honestly, I don't even think I'm going to vote this year, because frankly I don't want to cast my vote for anybody. Politicians are by nature evil.

cmgoodman1226 wrote:

pkay wrote:

collige wrote:I'm betting the second any of that stuff starts creeping out, most of the moderates are gonna start flying over to the Obama camp, not to mention everyone who's gonna vote for Obama when Ron Paul doesn't get the nomination.

Also

pkay wrote: This is how bush beat gore

gay marriage is how bush beat gore... and if you're going to say bush didn't win FL, 2 years ago they finally came out and said Bush did win FL. So that argument is dead. Infact Gore's recount he ordered ended up having bush by about 500

Anywho... my point is don't underestimate the republicans ability to rally the evangelical base. Underestimating that religious base is how bush was elected, twice.

Even if the moderates flock to Obama, there are still a large amount of evangelicals who blindly vote the way their pastors tell them to on sundays. The republicans are going to do their damnedest to make this a religious/morality election as its the ONLY way they'll win.

Yes, the Republicans are going to try to make it about religion and there are sure to be plenty of people who vote accordingly. I agree with that. But Obama has the lower middle class on lock. The Democrats have done a decent job at painting the Republicans as the party for the rich, and because of this the republicans have struggled to rally this base. And just like there's no shortage of people who vote blindly the way their pastor tells, there's no shortage of people who'll vote for obama because he's the "people's" president. I can't tell you how many callers I heard on Cspan radio the other day calling in and saying "I know the stimulous package worked because he gave money to the people". Back to the republicans though, Romney is the most electable and the only one that stands a chance. Sure there's a lot of evangelicals that will vote for Santorum, but there's also a lot of other Republicans who just aren't so sure of how he's voted in the past. And more likely than not, if Romney does win the primary, He's going to try to start shifting to the left to make himself seem more moderate. Either way, IMO the only thing the Republicans are going to have to stand on is the soaring gas prices (not saying Obama is to blame, but people like an easy scapegoat). The economy IS picking up and if that continues, Obamas approval rating will pick up as well. I'm not saying this election won't be close, but unless they reveal some sort of scandal on Obama, I think he's going to win. Honestly, I don't even think I'm going to vote this year, because frankly I don't want to cast my vote for anybody. Politicians are by nature evil.

i wouldnt say he has it on lock... at least not as much as last election.... a lot of people (myself included... a young minority) who are upset with Obamas effectiveness.

On the republican side, I think Romneys 'electableness" has taken a hit by some of his boneheaded actions and exchanges with Gengrich that cost him that status. Now, I believe, the most electable person and the most electable strategy has changed.

6 months ago the republican strategy was Romney via disatisfaction with Obama and economy

Now the republican strategy is swinging towards Santorum with morality and core family issues not surviving the Obama reign.

I'm 100% sure Obama will win, but I don't think it'll be a landslide and I think the election will rally the republican base a bit

on whether bush *really* won in florida ...

counting the ballots as cast as fairly and accurately as can be done doesn't resolve all the issues, because they include people wrongly prevented from casting ballots at all, e.g. the 96,000 people removed from voting rolls for having names and addresses vaguely resembling those on an inaccurate list of felons ... it was the best option that the courts could have ordered at the time - a full recount under as fair and consistent rules as they could come up with - but it wouldn't have fixed everything.

secondly, bush didn't win, because the 5 supreme court justices who prevented the recount from being completed were not making an honest attempt to apply the law as they understood it: they were deliberately fixing an election. so, even supposing that bush had more votes, he didn't win because he had more votes: he won because the 5 justices fixed the election.

sorry if i sounds obsessed, but sometimes it's worth repeating the bleedin' obvious ...

pkay wrote:
i wouldnt say he has it on lock... at least not as much as last election.... a lot of people (myself included... a young minority) who are upset with Obamas effectiveness.

On the republican side, I think Romneys 'electableness" has taken a hit by some of his boneheaded actions and exchanges with Gengrich that cost him that status. Now, I believe, the most electable person and the most electable strategy has changed.

6 months ago the republican strategy was Romney via disatisfaction with Obama and economy

Now the republican strategy is swinging towards Santorum with morality and core family issues not surviving the Obama reign.

I'm 100% sure Obama will win, but I don't think it'll be a landslide and I think the election will rally the republican base a bit

I think lots of people have been disappointed by Obama's impact (certainly over this side of the Atlantic) however he has been hindered significantly by a very obstructive, Congress who have done everything they can to disrupt his plans. Also I think expectations were just so high it was near impossible for people to be satisfied by his results, particularly in the current economic climate.

I think the Republican candidate race is fascinating. It seemed like a one horse race for ages. I do wonder whether the Media have exaggerated a lot of his 'mistakes' etc so as to make the race a bit more interesting.

who do i think will win? Barack Obama.

who do i want to win? Ron Paul.

I don't think US citizens feel like the president represents them, no matter who it is.
I like Ron Paul but Obama might be a better singer.

pkay wrote: Anywho... my point is don't underestimate the republicans ability to rally the evangelical base. Underestimating that religious base is how bush was elected, twice.

Even if the moderates flock to Obama, there are still a large amount of evangelicals who blindly vote the way their pastors tell them to on sundays. The republicans are going to do their damnedest to make this a religious/morality election as its the ONLY way they'll win.

This is spot on. It's probably hard for non-americans to fully grasp just how ignorant a large number of our voters are. There's stupid people everywhere, but redneck christians are just a different breed.

pkay wrote: i wouldnt say he has it on lock... at least not as much as last election.... a lot of people (myself included... a young minority) who are upset with Obamas effectiveness.

On the republican side, I think Romneys 'electableness" has taken a hit by some of his boneheaded actions and exchanges with Gengrich that cost him that status. Now, I believe, the most electable person and the most electable strategy has changed.

6 months ago the republican strategy was Romney via disatisfaction with Obama and economy

Now the republican strategy is swinging towards Santorum with morality and core family issues not surviving the Obama reign.

I'm 100% sure Obama will win, but I don't think it'll be a landslide and I think the election will rally the republican base a bit

At this point it's not a guarantee, if Santorum actually gets nominated, the Obama campaign will have no shortage of ammunition to make him look like a completely unelectable fool (his quote about not caring about the poor is a good example). You can't win an election just off social policy. The real difficulty is gonna be getting everyone who voted for Obama the first time to do it again.

Ron Paul is only good on foreign matters I think, his homeland and social ideas are backwards imo. I don't really label myself politically, but I side with beliefs held close by social anarchism. I would like less government too, but I would like what government we do have to work directly for the benefit of the people, instead of now where people work for government/corporate interests. He wants to limit too much of that for my tastes.

A vote for the right is a vote for religious zealots with their minds still in the Bronze Age and with downright stupid worries. Not down with that at all. Their main concerns stem from religion and gun rights. That said, I'm not a big fan of most Democrats either.

I think Obama will take it again. Especially if the reports coming out that he will have $1 billion+ backing him turn out true. Money does most of the talking in making people's decisions unfortunately.

Anyway, all of congress needs to be radically changed, not just a president

collige wrote:

pkay wrote: i wouldnt say he has it on lock... at least not as much as last election.... a lot of people (myself included... a young minority) who are upset with Obamas effectiveness.

On the republican side, I think Romneys 'electableness" has taken a hit by some of his boneheaded actions and exchanges with Gengrich that cost him that status. Now, I believe, the most electable person and the most electable strategy has changed.

6 months ago the republican strategy was Romney via disatisfaction with Obama and economy

Now the republican strategy is swinging towards Santorum with morality and core family issues not surviving the Obama reign.

I'm 100% sure Obama will win, but I don't think it'll be a landslide and I think the election will rally the republican base a bit

At this point it's not a guarantee, if Santorum actually gets nominated, the Obama campaign will have no shortage of ammunition to make him look like a completely unelectable fool (his quote about not caring about the poor is a good example). You can't win an election just off social policy. The real difficulty is gonna be getting everyone who voted for Obama the first time to do it again.

If Romney got elected Obama would make this a class election (dems want that anywho) and they'd just play these 2 clips over and over again rendering romney useless





the 'enjoy firing' and bet are damnnnnnnning for romney. Makes him look like an out of touch asshole.

I'm voting for Stewart Alexander on the SPUSA's ticket because a) I hate both the dems and the GOP, b)Obama is too far to the right of me, and c) It is literally impossible for Obama to have a chance in my district anyway. That being said, if you are set on voting for one of the two major parties, you'd have to be fucking retarded to vote for anyone but Barack Obama.

SCope13 wrote:you'd have to be fucking retarded to vote for anyone but Barack Obama.

Ol' Mitt has the "moderates" sewn up.

SCope13 wrote:I'm voting for Stewart Alexander on the SPUSA's ticket because a) I hate both the dems and the GOP, b)Obama is too far to the right of me, and c) It is literally impossible for Obama to have a chance in my district anyway. That being said, if you are set on voting for one of the two major parties, you'd have to be fucking retarded to vote for anyone but Barack Obama.

I like how basically you're saying anyone who's on the right is a retard. That's a liberal way of thinking...

Alright it's actually like this;

Out of all candidates running on the GOP side, Paul and Romney stand the best chance against Obama. That's what the polls show and that's what logic shows. There's two things you need to beat Obama at the time and that's Ron Paul supporters and independents. This is why Newt and Romney have been sucking up to Paul at the debates lately and why Paul and Romney have been friendly to each other so far. And why Santorum is trying to 'out-conservative' Paul (but falls flat on his face). Santorum and Gingrich consistently poll the worst again Obama. This is exactly why the Dems want them to be nominated and why they mostly target Romney in their attack ads.

Also, right now Romney is leading with allocated delegates followed by Ron Paul. The 'problem' for Romney is that Ron Paul's delegates are the most loyal out of all of them and with Gingrich and Santorum still in the race, the votes are still largely split, making it harder for Romney to wrap it up quickly (like McCain did last year), which could lead to a brokered convention.

Santorum standing a chance is absolute nonsense and no one takes that seriously. His anti-condom/anti-birth control views and stereotypical neo-conservatism make him the easiest target for a Obama landslide victory. He's worse than Palin. He's also made some anti-protestant comments in 2008, claiming that the church has been under the influence of Satan, which the Obama campaign would go to town on.

I know people would love to marginalize Paul, but he along with Romney stands the best chance against Obama and Ron Paul is the only one who has what all the other GOP candidates are currently fiending for Ron Paul supporters. A lot of which who may vote for Obama as a protest against the GOP if he isn't the nominee. So the GOP convention could end with a Romney/Paul (or vica versa) ticket, or even Rand Paul as Romney's VP.