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It's less guitar hero style than that shit Madeon was doing.

Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

Ocelots Revolver wrote:Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

maybe if you're a boring dj

Ocelots Revolver wrote:Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

Exactly.

Ocelots Revolver wrote:Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

Not saying there aren't DJ sets that aren't boring as fuck.


But the point here is when laptop DJs try and make something more out of what they're doing by saying it's a LIVE SET when it's really not.

Yeah I still consider it fundamentally DJing. Yes you're triggering clips instead of playing full tracks but you've also got the sync button. You're kind of obligated to do more than a vinyl DJ would, no need to get up your own ass pretending like it's hard. Beatmatching using only faders takes infinitely more skill than triggering clips every 8 bars or whatever. Ableton even quantizes the clip launches so you don't have to trigger them right on beat.

hifana have been doing this shit for years, only managed to catch one hour long set but itsbeen removed from yt

wub wrote:

Ocelots Revolver wrote:Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

Not saying there aren't DJ sets that aren't boring as fuck.


But the point here is when laptop DJs try and make something more out of what they're doing by saying it's a LIVE SET when it's really not.

I was commenting specifically on the actual performance of the DJ.

I remember reading an interview with abstract painter David Salle in a Sam Sheridan book. He said something like "I don't give a shit what you think your work is about. Don't even tell me." The idea is that your finished product is the only thing that weighs in on one's opinion, not the how or why you got there.

Basically, a DJ set is a form of performance art (though "performance entertainment" is probably a better definition because you are not there to express yourself, but rather to entertain the crowd), and therefore we grade the performer solely based on if he can blow da roof off da club.

Do the tools really matter? On the one hand humans don't seem to be impressed by using tools to achieve formerly difficult tasks. If they built an elevator to the top of Mt. Everest no one would give a shit about the people who made it to the summit. Feats are impressive largely because they are difficult or exclusive, which is why my above quote of Salle carries so much weight to me -because he comes from a modern art scene where everyone's first thought is "uh, I can draw better than this."

If the crowd is impressed that your beat-matching takes so much skill compared to a "Live" set that should come off in their response. If it doesn't, maybe your vinyl or CDJs really aren't all that important in achieving the goal that a DJ sets out for. I mean, most of the time the crowd can't even see whatever your doing behind the decks!

TL;DR

SunkLo wrote:Yeah I still consider it fundamentally DJing. Yes you're triggering clips instead of playing full tracks but you've also got the sync button. You're kind of obligated to do more than a vinyl DJ would, no need to get up your own ass pretending like it's hard. Beatmatching using only faders takes infinitely more skill than triggering clips every 8 bars or whatever. Ableton even quantizes the clip launches so you don't have to trigger them right on beat.

This is a really interesting topic but concerning the semantics of a "LIVE" set I think that its called that simply because people use Ableton Live rather than traditional DJ equipment.

One could argue that a set becomes "Live" as soon as the performer touches a single fader that changes the sound -even on a prerecorded set.

I tend to agree with you that using Ableton is a double edged sword. On the one hand it can be training wheels for your performance but on the other it gives you more creative options to explore. I tend to think that crowds do not care for beatmatching as much as the unique micro-edits Ableton offers.

Though as I've said, the real test of a DJ is to entertain the crowd using whatever tools at his disposal. I don't see this discussion as any different than producers using oldschool hardware samplers vs. DAWs so I don't understand the controversy within the music scene. The fans certainly don't appear to give a shit about the argument at all.

There are many paths to the top of the mountain, but the view is always the same.

(though "performance entertainment" is probably a better definition because you are not there to express yourself, but rather to entertain the crowd),

Youuuuuu, have been going to the wrong DJ sets!


ProTip: The skill of the DJ isn't in matching the BPMs of two records (as stated a few times above), the skill of the DJ is TUNE SELECTION.

i can't help it, i'm usually a bit disappointed if the performance is a live set as opposed to a DJ set. ok fiddling with 15k worth of gear for couple of hours can be impressive but boring. i'd rather a dj set where i can actually recognize the tracks and enjoy them.

on another note, i've fantasized about forming a band that would create the songs on a DAW but arrange them on tradiitonal band instruments with maybe a mpc or something thrown in there. also starting a gig with a short dj set and leaving the last song to loop then starting the live part by "mixing" it into the last song of the dj set. yeah nothing new i bet but would be cool

Capture pt wrote:

(though "performance entertainment" is probably a better definition because you are not there to express yourself, but rather to entertain the crowd),

Youuuuuu, have been going to the wrong DJ sets!


ProTip: The skill of the DJ isn't in matching the BPMs of two records (as stated a few times above), the skill of the DJ is TUNE SELECTION.

Are these two sentences related?

I'm guessing an argument about the value of good tune selection is not going to work out when 80% of the people on the forum are gamers who want to make it big by 'dropping da bass' in amazingly complex ableton mash-ups of Skrillex tracks.

Yeah no point in beatmatching either if you're only gonna play 4 seconds of a track.

SunkLo wrote:Yeah no point in beatmatching either if you're only gonna play 4 seconds of a track.

This, just cut out random parts of bro songs and put beat repeat on it.

FM radio > Beat Repeat > Lowpass
Fuck yea this DJ is awesome!

Ocelots Revolver wrote:Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

i take it you arent familiar with Oneman?

ehbrums1 wrote:

Ocelots Revolver wrote:Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

i take it you arent familiar with Oneman?

or selecting?

Nevalo wrote:

ehbrums1 wrote:

Ocelots Revolver wrote:Well its certainly more interesting than playing two songs at the same bpm and then crossfading from one to the other for two hours straight.

i take it you arent familiar with Oneman?

or selecting?

was using him as an example because his sets are really varied.