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yeah.. the RIAA has made sure that no one in the states cuts a loud record..

OoGuN wrote:

jaybird wrote:

OoGuN wrote:Any of you cutters fancy moving over to NZ?

google peter king records, I'm pretty sure he still operates his famous lathe. He is in NZ..

there are also a couple good cutters on that big island next door..
http://zenithrecords.org/

hey cheers for that info. Found the Peter King stuff really fascinating and will have a look at the zenith one too. At the moment I'm sending my dubs to Bristol to get them cut...

Yeah.. Peter King releases are pretty cool... They are hand cut, and not pressed. definately a collectors item.. I might do this if I cannot find someone to press my stuff..

jaybird wrote:yeah.. the RIAA has made sure that no one in the states cuts a loud record..

just to jump in but out of curiosity why?

the RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) came up with the recording curve, and volume standards for vinyl records. Most lathe operators, and all vinyl record factories are members of the RIAA.
Maximum volume for vinyl following RIAA standard is +4db/0. Usually the cutter will do it lower.

And now it seems that the RIAA can tell you what your allowed to put on a vinyl record. They have a no Sampling policy, and if they find that you indeed sampled with out royality, most factories will not complete your order, and still charge you for it. They will also dime you out to the artist you sampled, in hopes that you will be sued. Complete B.S, but that discussion is for another thread.

I think US artist have been hampered by this treatment. They say it's about money, but I think it's about control.

jaybird wrote:the RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) came up with the recording curve, and volume standards for vinyl records. Most lathe operators, and all vinyl record factories are members of the RIAA.
Maximum volume for vinyl following RIAA standard is +4db/0. Usually the cutter will do it lower.

And now it seems that the RIAA can tell you what your allowed to put on a vinyl record. They have a no Sampling policy, and if they find that you indeed sampled with out royality, most factories will not complete your order, and still charge you for it. They will also dime you out to the artist you sampled, in hopes that you will be sued. Complete B.S, but that discussion is for another thread.

I think US artist have been hampered by this treatment. They say it's about money, but I think it's about control.

i guess people get em pressed abroad then?

it is about control yes...a massive label can easily afford to pay to sample something legally (nas sampled apache legally) but anything independent & probably better doesn't have that kind of backing...

Piston wrote:
i guess people get em pressed abroad then?

I'm sure, the guys I know found ways to get signed to labels in europe.

The kicker is that in the states theres a thing call "Fair Use" and the supreme court has ruled that sampling small portions of copyright material is okay. The RIAA and the Faactories will not honor this, and when asked about it, they will skirt around the questions.

"The Supreme Court of the United States described fair use as an affirmative defense in Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music, Inc..[15] This means that, in litigation on copyright infringement, the defendant bears the burden of raising and proving that his use was "fair" and not an infringement. Thus, fair use need not even be raised as a defense unless the plaintiff first shows (or the defendant concedes) a "prima facie" case of copyright infringement. If the work was not copyrightable, the term had expired, or the defendant's work borrowed only a small amount, for instance, then the plaintiff cannot make out a prima facie case of infringement, and the defendant need not even raise the fair use defense."


BAM!!! Sampling is legal, they can't sue you, and you don't have to pay shit.. Unless your dealing with the RIAA, and your pressing vinyl. I guess the RIAA's power even supersedes the supreme court..

jaybird wrote:the RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) came up with the recording curve, and volume standards for vinyl records. Most lathe operators, and all vinyl record factories are members of the RIAA.
Maximum volume for vinyl following RIAA standard is +4db/0. Usually the cutter will do it lower.

And now it seems that the RIAA can tell you what your allowed to put on a vinyl record. They have a no Sampling policy, and if they find that you indeed sampled with out royality, most factories will not complete your order, and still charge you for it. They will also dime you out to the artist you sampled, in hopes that you will be sued. Complete B.S, but that discussion is for another thread.

I think US artist have been hampered by this treatment. They say it's about money, but I think it's about control.

Kanye West must be broke.

Ashley wrote:

jaybird wrote:the RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) came up with the recording curve, and volume standards for vinyl records. Most lathe operators, and all vinyl record factories are members of the RIAA.
Maximum volume for vinyl following RIAA standard is +4db/0. Usually the cutter will do it lower.

And now it seems that the RIAA can tell you what your allowed to put on a vinyl record. They have a no Sampling policy, and if they find that you indeed sampled with out royality, most factories will not complete your order, and still charge you for it. They will also dime you out to the artist you sampled, in hopes that you will be sued. Complete B.S, but that discussion is for another thread.

I think US artist have been hampered by this treatment. They say it's about money, but I think it's about control.

Kanye West must be broke.

hmmm, yeah if this policy/legislation is in force, surely alot of american artists are in deep trouble right?

i'm guessing artists like Kanye have lawyers to deal with getting round these issues?

^^
nah they just clear the samples and pay the royalties

jaybird wrote:b/c of my ear, brain, and computer I can trick this bitch into doing things she wouldn't normally want to do..

like anal..

Wicked thread, actually full of interesting information.

gaston_UK wrote:
hmmm, yeah if this policy/legislation is in force, surely alot of american artists are in deep trouble right?

Not really, it just prevents anyone from doing vinyl. As far as underground music.

Seldom do they sue, and if they did surely "fair use" would take president.
Is all about the Factories refusing to press, and taking your money.

If I started a label, and they refused to press my vinyl, and they took my money for the order. I would be bust, and my label would die.

Piston wrote:

jaybird wrote:yeah.. the RIAA has made sure that no one in the states cuts a loud record..

just to jump in but out of curiosity why?

the recording curve thing probably came about originally because they use compressors during broadcast, so if the record is over loud and then sucked up further by the compressor, it'll end up sounding over squashed.

it's probably an outdated and restrictive standard though, because processes for cutting vinyl loud have got better over the years, and the RIAA don't seem to have stopped mastering houses squashing CDs up to 0db!

the recording curve thing probably came about originally because they use compressors during broadcast, so if the record is over loud and then sucked up further by the compressor, it'll end up sounding over squashed.

it's probably an outdated and restrictive standard though, because processes for cutting vinyl loud have got better over the years, and the RIAA don't seem to have stopped mastering houses squashing CDs up to 0db!

Nope..

The recording curve is there to allow more time on the disc. Bass frequencies are very long/fat waves, soo you need to lower the volume of the bass to fit music on the plate. Volume = Time, Louder = Less..

CD's are digital and are not effect by this.

OoGuN wrote:

jaybird wrote:

OoGuN wrote:Any of you cutters fancy moving over to NZ?

google peter king records, I'm pretty sure he still operates his famous lathe. He is in NZ..

there are also a couple good cutters on that big island next door..
http://zenithrecords.org/

hey cheers for that info. Found the Peter King stuff really fascinating and will have a look at the zenith one too. At the moment I'm sending my dubs to Bristol to get them cut...

glad I could help out. There are couple of vidz on utube that show his operation..

I have a dubplate cutting/vinyl mastering operation; just moved from Louisiana to Tennessee but will be back up and running soon. Two cutting suites; one Scully/Westrex stereo suite and one Scully/Grampian mono suite. Didn't read absolutely every post, but RIAA doesn't limit level, the sound being recorded and the run time does. RIAA is just the curve; you can push it but above a certain level a TT can't track it. Just joined - hit me up for info.

EFA wrote:I aways thought you got a better sound by having a faster RPM - IE: 45 RPM 12" should sound better than 33RPM 10" would like to know this from Jaybird and J if poss as will be cuttin plates soon!

I originally used Vinyl Carvers on 10" but found the grooves pretty shallow & volume a bit low however the sound was good with nice bass. Anyone able to report on Dubstudios plates?

I've used Transition and Dubstudio, I prefered Dubstudio but it's a very different sound. Dubstudio is vinyl dubs, not acetates, so if you want your records to smell wierd you cant!

Joe C wrote:

EFA wrote:I aways thought you got a better sound by having a faster RPM - IE: 45 RPM 12" should sound better than 33RPM 10" would like to know this from Jaybird and J if poss as will be cuttin plates soon!

I originally used Vinyl Carvers on 10" but found the grooves pretty shallow & volume a bit low however the sound was good with nice bass. Anyone able to report on Dubstudios plates?

I've used Transition and Dubstudio, I prefered Dubstudio but it's a very different sound. Dubstudio is vinyl dubs, not acetates, so if you want your records to smell wierd you cant!

I thought dubstudio did acetates aswell?

NilsFG wrote:

Joe C wrote:

EFA wrote:I aways thought you got a better sound by having a faster RPM - IE: 45 RPM 12" should sound better than 33RPM 10" would like to know this from Jaybird and J if poss as will be cuttin plates soon!

I originally used Vinyl Carvers on 10" but found the grooves pretty shallow & volume a bit low however the sound was good with nice bass. Anyone able to report on Dubstudios plates?

I've used Transition and Dubstudio, I prefered Dubstudio but it's a very different sound. Dubstudio is vinyl dubs, not acetates, so if you want your records to smell wierd you cant!

I thought dubstudio did acetates aswell?

yeah they do thats what i cut with dubstudio! and they are weighty

jaybird wrote: I can even show you how to wire your cartridges to force the PA into mono..

oooh, i would be interested to know how to do this please
i got one speaker with my decks and the other with my laptop...being able to run my decks in mono would be fucking sweeeeeeet!

i'm rocking the m447s at the mo if that makes a difference..

quality, always wanted to know more about this side of things...good read.

i can record off radio to tape casette if anyones interested