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3DM wrote: Turns out that Leon Trotsky also wrote a fair bit about the role of art in the revolutionary society too, and put into writing how much he hated Stalin by this means too!

and he lived with freida kahlo & diego rivera in mexico city

Last book I read:

Defying Hitler by Sebastian Haffner

Highly recommended: account of living in izan Germany, written at the time, sadly never completed...

Also recommend pretty much anyhting by Iain Banks - especially Crow Road.
His Sci-fi stuff is good too if your into that. Excession. Nuff said.

Foucault is slightly head mashing, but its good stuff, stick at it!
Baudrillard good too, but much of the post-modern stylings put me off. Sometimes resembles watching Steve Vai play solo guitar for 3 hours compared to watching a tight 4 piece. I.e. nice ideas, but a bit wanky.

Look at me, i just used a clever word trick! I'm so post/modern.
ho ho

3DM wrote:I'd recommend "Fast Food Nation" by Eric Schlosser which I read about a year ago.

It's enough to make you both Anarchist and Vegetarian reading about the horrors of abattoirs and so-called rendering plants (serious cruelty to the Human animal going on in there too) and the way the fast food corporations manipulate U.S. from an early age (targetted marketing, sponsorship of school curriculums, as well as fixing up the menus in the canteens), then go union busting if we dare to get organised against them.

Not forgetting the addictive and insulogenic properties of monosodium glutamate, which fast food - and most savory convenience foods in general now - is dripping with. It may as well be the new nicotine. Did Schlosser touch on that in the book? I've been meaning to read it...

gravious wrote:Last book I read:

Defying Hitler by Sebastian Haffner

Highly recommended: account of living in izan Germany, written at the time, sadly never completed...

Also recommend pretty much anyhting by Iain Banks - especially Crow Road.
His Sci-fi stuff is good too if your into that. Excession. Nuff said.

Foucault is slightly head mashing, but its good stuff, stick at it!
Baudrillard good too, but much of the post-modern stylings put me off. Sometimes resembles watching Steve Vai play solo guitar for 3 hours compared to watching a tight 4 piece. I.e. nice ideas, but a bit wanky.

Look at me, i just used a clever word trick! I'm so post/modern.
ho ho

no ones ready for foucault even my highly educated professors were like...i aint ready...this is more than long

foucault like most pomo guys is about illustrating superstructures of power, like how psychology can be used to make people feel mad, and how that benefits the state. it seems pretty obvious in prozac-for-profit culture.

focusing on superstructure though i think it tends to be self-defeating. if you are individually involved in some slice of "the system" (non-capital) that needs fixing, you can see with foucault how your institution relates to other institutions.

it makes people on the outside of power feel powerless though, and i think their rhetoric does the same. smart people dont believe in intelligence.

it's long though...yeah.

Not forgetting the addictive and insulogenic properties of monosodium glutamate, which fast food - and most savory convenience foods in general now - is dripping with. It may as well be the new nicotine. Did Schlosser touch on that in the book? I've been meaning to read it...

Yeah, he does.
It's just that there's so much ground covered in this book, it's difficult to summarise!


Other aspects he goes into is the fact that there is a multimillion dollar industry (plus R&D projects) just for the artificial fragrances and flavourings which are used in these, erm, foodstuffs (I use the term 'foodstuffs' very loosely here), and also that supermarkets pump out these fake fragrances over their food halls via the air conditioning, to subliminally tempt you into buying this crap!

And yes, I knew about the Trotsky/Kahlo connection.
Now I bet THAT was an interesting house to hang out in...!

3DM wrote:Yeah, he does.
It's just that there's so much ground covered in this book, it's difficult to summarise!


Other aspects he goes into is the fact that there is a multimillion dollar industry (plus R&D projects) just for the artificial fragrances and flavourings which are used in these, erm, foodstuffs (I use the term 'foodstuffs' very loosely here), and also that supermarkets pump out these fake fragrances over their food halls via the air conditioning, to subliminally tempt you into buying this crap!

No wonder I always linger in the cookie aisle en route to broccoli.

I'll go one step further and say that the 'foodstuff' industry sustains the diet industry and the healthcare industry. (Reference ADRUU's comment upthread about prozac-for-profit.) There's so much money to be made in keeping people fat and unhealthy, especially in places like the US where healthcare isn't government-subsidized.

Sounds like a must-read anyway, thanks for the recommendation.

No wonder I always linger in the cookie aisle en route to broccoli.

Yeah, there might be more to that action than you think!

I'll go one step further and say that the 'foodstuff' industry sustains the diet industry and the healthcare industry. (Reference ADRUU's comment upthread about prozac-for-profit.) There's so much money to be made in keeping people fat and unhealthy, especially in places like the US where healthcare isn't government-subsidized.

And of course, linked to all this are the fashion, advertising and cosmetic surgery industries, who are always telling peeps (mainly women) how terrible they look, therefore instilling a sense of shame about our own bodies into us from an early age, therefore we go out and spend money on their pointless pills, potions, plans and surgery.

Personally, I think it's healthy to have a little puppy fat (not being obese though), instead of being just skin, bone and paranoid.

And besides, if those infamous Mongolian nomads can live to a ripe old age (which many of them do) on a diet of saturated Goat fats, it can't be all that bad for you, so long as you counterbalance it with lots of exercise like they do.

The real killer is combining this kind of diet with a sedentary lifestyle, which is the mistake most Westerners make.

Sounds like a must-read anyway, thanks for the recommendation.

It's a window onto the truth, mate.
Seek it out.

In the meantime, learn to love thyself, because in doing that one simple thing, you immediately see that all the negative propaganda generated by these industries is completely irrelevant nonsense.

Fast Food Nation by Eric Schlosser.

gravious wrote:Also recommend pretty much anyhting by Iain Banks - especially Crow Road.
His Sci-fi stuff is good too if your into that. Excession. Nuff said.

Feersum Endjin is great.

I've got Complicity sitting at home on my shelf ready to be read, but I understand The Wasp Factory is supposed to be one of his best.

no ones ready for foucault even my highly educated professors were like...i aint ready...this is more than long[/quote]


Foucault is a fake! Try looking at "A dictionary of Fashionable nonsense" (cant remember writers!!) Full of larfs - debunks all this French bollox amongst a load of other post-modernist psuedo-left stuff

i agree! but it makes good dinner party conversation

Spaceboy wrote:i agree! but it makes good dinner party conversation

Should read the book above bruv - it's exactly that - how to bluff your way in a dinner party type of thing. There's a website - sth like butterflies and wheels or sth like that.

Just read "The Glory Game" by Hunter Davies (A year with Spurs back in the day). They won the UEFA cup so it really is ancient memories type of thing!

If you want your head intentionally mashed politically check out some Guy Debord, although he does piss me off sometimes

This thread is one heavy reading list! If you read everything on here you would be one well informed mo fo!

Tusk wrote:
Lovecraft, Nietchze, Hakim Bey, Antonin Artaud, Crowely, Phil Pullman
Ayn Rand

do you predominantly wear black too?

only jokin, I too love a bit of lovecraft.

and bauhaus

I dont know the hand gestures for "temple of love" though, gotta draw the line

unlikely wrote:If you want your head intentionally mashed politically check out some Guy Debord, although he does piss me off sometimes

This thread is one heavy reading list! If you read everything on here you would be one well informed mo fo!

amen to that

there are a fair few good gems in here, I've got a few more to post up myself

TechMouse wrote:

gravious wrote:Also recommend pretty much anyhting by Iain Banks - especially Crow Road.
His Sci-fi stuff is good too if your into that. Excession. Nuff said.

Feersum Endjin is great.

I've got Complicity sitting at home on my shelf ready to be read, but I understand The Wasp Factory is supposed to be one of his best.

Feersum Endjinn is FoOkING ACE!!

Might have to re-read it soon



Cheers to whoever recommended Scanner Darkly further up this thread, reading it this week, its sweet!!

not seen this thread for a few times. Good to see it back. We should keep this going. TOP. Ye get me

Just read: Phillip K. Dick "A Scanner Darkly"
Now reading: William Gibson "Virtual Light" (then I'll be reading the other 2 books in the "bridge" trilogy)

I've just finished a book called "The War Over Iraq" written by a couple of right-wing journalists (one of them works for Fox News). I decided to read it just to inform myself of exactly where these crazy neo-cons are coming from. Almost every page filled me with rage, these guys live in some kind of alternate reality. Click the link to find out what makes these guys tick (links to another thread on this forum)

http://dubstepforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=6141

Whenever I read books I love it, and get really into them and tell myself I should read more. Then I finish the book and don't pick another one up for 6 months or so. Last book I read was Steppenwolf which was excellent and currently I'm on this