Dubstepforum.com

well i been mixing on table's for yrs but been thinking of switching to cdj's as i dont have serato's and its hard for me to find vinyl these days..

but i prefer vinyl.

do you like to play live on ableton,cdj's or 1200's or 1210's or anything else?

anyone play live on ableton?

what is that like?

i like vinyl - i dont get on too well with cdj's

serato is good, but thats cause its just like using vinyl

i like the idea of doing something creative/interesting with live. but i haven't actually figured it out properly yet, waiting till i get a laptop then im gonna get on it.

gravity wrote:i like vinyl - i dont get on too well with cdj's

serato is good, but thats cause its just like using vinyl

i like the idea of doing something creative/interesting with live. but i haven't actually figured it out properly yet, waiting till i get a laptop then im gonna get on it.

yea serato kinda sound great too but its just carrying the whole box and laptop to a gig is another thing.

with cdj's you would have to carry your cd case around. i'd just go for serato.

When i first wanted a dj setup i wasnt sure if i wanted cdj's or tables.
Chose tables because of the serato solution.

btw you can allways get the vinyls you want from the internet, just order a bunch
and the shipping wont be too much of a pain.

How does Serato work? I'm looking at the site but its not explaining much... Why is it better than CDJ's?

thierry_le_dj wrote:well i been mixing on table's for yrs but been thinking of switching to cdj's as i dont have serato's and its hard for me to find vinyl these days..

but i prefer vinyl.

do you like to play live on ableton,cdj's or 1200's or 1210's or anything else?

anyone play live on ableton?

what is that like?

I only mix records because it is a challenge and I enjoy it!

Serato uses timecode vinyls to make mp3s over your decks, allowng your mixer/decks to serve as a sort control surface for mp3 mixing. its seamless, low latency, and not the only name on the time code market. Personally, an audio-8 and traktor seems to be about ideal, but, its all aobut how you wire everything... having a little cheapo midi controlller helps too when your working pc sde, eliminates the need to touch the computer for those last couple tasks...

I honestly would say its probably best to round yourself out as best as you can... ideally id say a 4 channel with cdjs and 1210s, an audio 8, trakor responding to both cdjs and the decks (keep in mind, there making timecode cds these days too).... This would pretty much (assuming youd chain it like I would) allow any device to be substituted with traktor while still leaving me open for cds and vinyl when id want to play em...

I like to use vinyl and get free beer when I play out

If the night doesn't have 1200/1210s its not really good times.

Vinyl and acetates only aside from dubs I didn't get cut yet, then it's serato or cd for those few tunes. Most people I've seen use abelton don't play it like a live pa. It's all prebuilt playlists with the tracks "warped" and auto beatmatched perfectly (no headphones needed) then just a controller to trigger parts of the playlist with knobs mapped to effects like filters and whatnot. Minimal skill needed for that. Don't get me wrong though, you can do some original shit and push the limits if you want, but most use it as a lazy-no-skill-required-dj tool. I've seen a couple people on cdjs do every single mix-out with effects (primarily delay loops), have the next tune cued up on a drop, and when the delay starts "glitching" they just cut it out, hit play and drop the next tune - another lazy way to avoid beatmatching. 99% of the people I see use serato are visual mixing instead of actually listening or knowing their tunes. A guy I know sold his serato because it was turning him into a visual dj.

I'm going off on a tangent here, but what it comes down to is whether you want to be a purist or not. With the technology today, anyone can be a dj without having any skill at all. Everything can be perfectly beatmatched, cued and looped for you. Do you want to be just another mp3/visual dj or do you want to keep the real tradition with vinyl alive? I think it's good to know how to use everything just so you can if you wanted or had to, but stay away from the "cheater tools" unless you are doing some mind blowing shit with them. At least with vinyl you don't have to worry about a computer crashing, hdd failure, poor quality tunes due to compression, etc. In my eyes, the only plus side with digital is that you have the ability to play a much bigger selection of tunes that are not on vinyl, and that's really the only reason I would go that route. If you are touring a lot, digital is really the only way unless you don't mind carting crates and crates of records to keep your sets diverse or you are playing the same shit all the time. Serato is definitely the closest to vinyl you can get. I'd go the Serato route, but then I think of how much vinyl I could get for the price of it and a laptop to run it, plus I already have cdjs.

My setup consists of both vinyl and cdj. I get the best of both worlds this way, tunes i can't get on vinyl, I can play out using my cdjs, and tunes that are available on vinyl, i will mix using my turntables...and i either turn off the auto bpm counter on my cdjs, or simply put tape over it on the display, then its almost the same.

As a student, i can't afford a whole set on vinyl. Beatport is much cheaper. I know DJs that use serato, and get on with it well though, i will try it out one day. Im not too sure ableton is the way forward though.

legend4ry wrote:I like to use vinyl and get free beer when I play out

If the night doesn't have 1200/1210s its not really good times.

if they had vestax i would happy hahahaha but technics will do i suppose.

turned up to one gig and they had belt drive stantons, was not impressed

relik wrote:Vinyl and acetates only aside from dubs I didn't get cut yet, then it's serato or cd for those few tunes. Most people I've seen use abelton don't play it like a live pa. It's all prebuilt playlists with the tracks "warped" and auto beatmatched perfectly (no headphones needed) then just a controller to trigger parts of the playlist with knobs mapped to effects like filters and whatnot. Minimal skill needed for that. Don't get me wrong though, you can do some original shit and push the limits if you want, but most use it as a lazy-no-skill-required-dj tool. I've seen a couple people on cdjs do every single mix-out with effects (primarily delay loops), have the next tune cued up on a drop, and when the delay starts "glitching" they just cut it out, hit play and drop the next tune - another lazy way to avoid beatmatching. 99% of the people I see use serato are visual mixing instead of actually listening or knowing their tunes. A guy I know sold his serato because it was turning him into a visual dj.

I'm going off on a tangent here, but what it comes down to is whether you want to be a purist or not. With the technology today, anyone can be a dj without having any skill at all. Everything can be perfectly beatmatched, cued and looped for you. Do you want to be just another mp3/visual dj or do you want to keep the real tradition with vinyl alive? I think it's good to know how to use everything just so you can if you wanted or had to, but stay away from the "cheater tools" unless you are doing some mind blowing shit with them. At least with vinyl you don't have to worry about a computer crashing, hdd failure, poor quality tunes due to compression, etc. In my eyes, the only plus side with digital is that you have the ability to play a much bigger selection of tunes that are not on vinyl, and that's really the only reason I would go that route. If you are touring a lot, digital is really the only way unless you don't mind carting crates and crates of records to keep your sets diverse or you are playing the same shit all the time. Serato is definitely the closest to vinyl you can get. I'd go the Serato route, but then I think of how much vinyl I could get for the price of it and a laptop to run it, plus I already have cdjs.

have you seen bassnectar play live?

If you really wanna keep the tradition fuck vinyl and start mixing on tape decks or reel to reel ...I've mixed on Ableton A/B type basic mixing (Just at home or w/ the homies) and to me if your going to do that then just learn to beat match on Table/CDJs. Though until you get tables or whatnot. I think it can help you in the mean time as far timing, and seeing how well tracks blend & just getting a feel for it. I have mixed on vinyl, but just feel restricted, and enjoy the freedom that Ableton allows me (Chopping up tunes, adding your own builds, drums, just mashing it up). When I do play out I play all my own tunes (Chopping of the stems of the original tunes) playing out melodies, basslines, drums, vocal stabs. I run anywhere from a 4-8 channel setup 2 sends, effects, and alot of creativity. I think the real creativity shines through in your mixes, choice of tunes, and the way you flips things. I do think some people (Purists) get kind of butt hurt due to the time & effort they put into it learning these skills (beatmatching, timing, track selection, etc), which I can understand. My thing with ableton is I always make sure it can't be done on Tables/CDJs, and always trying to push things. I just love the control of changing, blendin, editing tracks into something a little different, & interesting. To end this rant I believe it was Bassnectar who said when asked
What do you think of digital dj technology?

Its awesome. In some senses, it changes the “sport”…whereas one of the GOALS used to be beatmatching, that is now pretty irrelevant. And its sad, if your sport was showing off how wonderfully you can beat match, because that has really become obsolete. Although i can beat match as instantaneously as the next DJ, i don’t give a rat’s ass about doing it and making people watch me do it. I’m rather much more interested in creating and collecting awesome sounds, and layering, combining and broadcasting them as a means to conjur up an energetically cathartic experience for other humans.

I gotta give mad, endless props to Ableton LIVE, may God bless her soul.


All in all whatever your choice may be whatever you do..Do it well, and most won't question you...

i use 1210s and love erm!
recently got a cdj DN-S3500 and once you get past the stage of learning to mix AGAIN!
they r good NOT VINYL but good

sub swara: ableton
solo: ideally, serato & vinyls on perfectly-functioning 1200s. if the 12s are busted, i'd rather use serato-only on cdj's than deal with fucked-up decks.

i love vinyl, i love turntables and my wall of records keeps growing and growing. In major cities, playing vinyl, etc is great but if you've got a gig that's put together with a lot of heart and corners are cut, decks are prone to feedback issues, grounding, power, etc. unless they're in perfect condition-- vinyl can be a real pain in the ass.

if you dj without using your ears, you're wack. end of story. Ableton gives you great freedom in that you're no longer bound by pitch/tempo/etc-- if all you do is use that to cue things up... weak.

DISCLAIMER: I love the vinyl most of all - there now I got that out of the way ...

I hate to think of people ditching vinyl for the relentless compression of MP3s but I think serato is the way to go if you see it as a one or the other thing (which you really dont have to).

CDJs are unsatisfying to play with - theres no weight or feel behind them - its picking your nose with a rubber glove on.

At least serato will allow you to use the skills you have built up with vinyl.

Im seriously thinking of starting a night where only vinyl is played ... its becoming so rare nowadays - it is a novelty to hear any warmth in a club.

Ill get on board with Serato one day but having had CDJs for years I just find them souless and clumsy

To be fair i have always tried and exclusively use vinyl... I preffer everything about it, i like the fact that everything is done by ear and more importantly i prefer the feel.
BUT it is a big but, im getting so fed up with firstly the price (i just dont have the money to buy all the vinyls i need/want) and most importantly im getting fed up of not being able to find the vinyl i want. I've got a long list of vinyls i wanted to purchase but i literally cannot find anywhere... Been considering getting Traktor or Serato... Feels abit like im cheating and it just doesnt feel right for me but atleast i have a much bigger collection of tunes at my disposal.

nick fury wrote: Its awesome. In some senses, it changes the “sport”…whereas one of the GOALS used to be beatmatching, that is now pretty irrelevant. And its sad, if your sport was showing off how wonderfully you can beat match, because that has really become obsolete. Although i can beat match as instantaneously as the next DJ, i don’t give a rat’s ass about doing it and making people watch me do it. I’m rather much more interested in creating and collecting awesome sounds, and layering, combining and broadcasting them as a means to conjur up an energetically cathartic experience for other humans.

I gotta give mad, endless props to Ableton LIVE, may God bless her soul.

bassnectar is a genius. i completely agree, beatmatching is important when playing decks but ableton has opened up an entire new realm of creativity...instead of wasting so much time and effort trying to beatmatch perfectly, it is done for you which gives you the oppurtunity to do soooooo many other things. endless possibilities with live. thankyou ableton!

eops wrote: its picking your nose with a rubber glove on.

a very amusing expression mate

Beatfreak919 wrote:have you seen bassnectar play live?

No, but I heard he isn't very good...talks too much and just stops the music a lot. I could care less about what other people use as long as they are rocking it. I just can't get into a groove when a set is primarily pre-planned and nothing is going on except some occasional filter sweeps and other effects. I don't think people who play vinyl only are all gung-ho, elitist or "showing off" how wonderfully they can beat match either. It doesn't really require a lot of effort or time...only ears. It's just part of playing vinyl and beat matching is like riding a bike. 99% of the time I play out I have no idea what records I am playing, let alone have even listened to them prior. Being able to read a crowd and build your set on the fly is what it's all about. I'd like to see more people push the limits and do 100% live percussion chopping with live triggered loops, etc. but a lot of people using a setup that would allow them to do that and get creative take the easy way out. Props to those being creative with what they have instead of being lazy.