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If you create a melody using a scale, do you need to start and end the melody with the same note?
Also, does the melody have to be 8 notes?

Im having trouble understanding the concept of creating a melody out of a scale... Can you just pick any random notes from a particular scale or should they go in ascending or descending order?

krispy wrote:If you create a melody using a scale, do you need to start and end the melody with the same note?
Also, does the melody have to be 8 notes?

absolutely not. whatever gave you that idea? don't you listen to music?

krispy wrote:If you create a melody using a scale, do you need to start and end the melody with the same note?
Also, does the melody have to be 8 notes?

Im having trouble understanding the concept of creating a melody out of a scale... Can you just pick any random notes from a particular scale or should they go in ascending or descending order?

a scale is simply a basis around which to construct harmony and melody.
the melody doesn't have to start and end the same, however some use of the root or tonic note (the 1st in the scale) is useful when establishing a tonal centre.

melody writing is complicated and i don't know much about it, the best advice is always just to use your ears!

The melody can be however long you'd like it to be as long as it fits into the time signature.

Starting on the root note is usually a good idea because, like apathesis said, it helps establish a tonal center and ensures no wonkyness.

Do whatever you want though, as long as you think it sound good.

A scale is like a palette: using a particular scale means you choose from the notes in the scale, but it doesn't say anything about how you arrange those notes. Scales are less complicated than you seem to think they are. If you just make up a melody without thinking, you'll most likely make one in a major or minor scale, since you've been trained from birth to understand music using those scales. Learning about scales doesn't mean learning some kind of special rules you have to follow, it's just learning to understand explictly what you already understand implicitly.
Music theory doesn't tell you what you should do, it tells you how to do what you want to do.

^ Well said.

makerowner wrote:A scale is like a palette: using a particular scale means you choose from the notes in the scale, but it doesn't say anything about how you arrange those notes. Scales are less complicated than you seem to think they are. If you just make up a melody without thinking, you'll most likely make one in a major or minor scale, since you've been trained from birth to understand music using those scales. Learning about scales doesn't mean learning some kind of special rules you have to follow, it's just learning to understand explictly what you already understand implicitly.
Music theory doesn't tell you what you should do, it tells you how to do what you want to do.

Absolutely. Kudos.

Fucking, just get a keyboard, and learn a scale in an appropriate key. Just learn the mf inside and out. Like you don't even have to look at the keyboard, your fingers go to the right place automatically. That is what a scale is good for. When you have musical ideas, they'll just come out, and everything will work. Makes things a lot easier.

nowaysj wrote:Fucking, just get a keyboard, and learn a scale in an appropriate key. Just learn the mf inside and out. Like you don't even have to look at the keyboard, your fingers go to the right place automatically. That is what a scale is good for. When you have musical ideas, they'll just come out, and everything will work. Makes things a lot easier.

yeah i only have the c minor scale memorized but it helps out a lot to be able to tap some notes out that you know sound good together. im trying to learn more still

you should try just programming a melody without thinking about a scale, chances are the melody you played will be in some kind of scale/mode and figuring chords out for atmosphere and pads will just sort of click, ie, you'll know when they don't work and sound shit and you'll know when you've hit on the right sound, you could then try and discern which scale you've used.

lyons238 wrote:

nowaysj wrote:Fucking, just get a keyboard, and learn a scale in an appropriate key. Just learn the mf inside and out. Like you don't even have to look at the keyboard, your fingers go to the right place automatically. That is what a scale is good for. When you have musical ideas, they'll just come out, and everything will work. Makes things a lot easier.

yeah i only have the c minor scale memorized but it helps out a lot to be able to tap some notes out that you know sound good together. im trying to learn more still

hey OP dont over think scales and whatnot remember it's just a theory.

and to help memorize a scale major, minor, just go by this to create any type of natural scale.

major - Whole step, Whole step, Half step, Whole, Whole, Whole, Half

minor - Whole step, Half step, Whole step, Whole step, Half step, Whole, Whole

whole step = tone
half step = semitone

follow that order and no matter what key you play in you will get that type of scale natural. I'm not really sure on harmonic, melodic scales and whatnot i'm still learning in music theory. damn, if you are really not sure go take some classes get educated.

Hypefiend wrote: and to help memorize a scale major, minor, just go by this to create any type of natural scale.

major - Whole step, Whole step, Half step, Whole, Whole, Whole, Half

minor - Whole step, Half step, Whole step, Whole step, Half step, Whole, Whole

whole step = tone
half step = semitone

this!
I would also like to add that it is usually a good idea to start and end your melody on the 1st 4th or 5th (and 8th, but that's a whole octave...) note of the scale otherwise you are left with an "incomplete" sounding melody. You can however use this to build up tension and then release it with a complete riff ending on a "proper" tone.
I find it also helps to keep a reference of basic scale modes on hand, such as blues/pentatonic, harmonic and meldodic minor, etc. It's much easier to get ideas out of your head and into notes if you have a basic understanding of how most modes sound. you can find this sort of thing easily on the internet.
All of this being said, there is no substitute for banging away on a real keyboard and getting a visual representation of what you're doing.

Like what has been said, if you're gonna memorize a scale, memorize the distance between the notes, not the notes themselves. That way you can use different keys without having to look them up. It is leaps easier than trying to memorize every individual scale for every root note.

Thanks for the good replies, I am reading this book on music theory so just try to grasp the concept

Not looking to memorize scales or anything or rely on them in any way
Just trying to better understand how people use them to create melodies etc.

o and a chord is made up in a major scale by using the 1st 3rd and 5th key.
which can be used to fill out the sound if your certain scale is dull

In case you're interested in giving this one a skim (pdf's around the net): The complete idiot's guide to music theory, http://books.google.com/books?id=sTMbuSQdqPMC . I personally like the simple, engineering-like approach to explaining the basics of the theory. Like an octave actually having 12 equally-spaced tones, the major chords being a 1-5-8 combo, minor ones being 1-4-8 and so on.

[off-topic]
For me, personally, the conventions in music theory are even more retarded than the qwerty layout. The twelve-tone equal temperament's good, but why the fuck do we still have to separate it into white and black keys, sharps and flats. Just fuck it away and go with octave/tone numbering. 0/158 or a 0/1-major, for all I care. Just make it a bit more consistent.
But I know it's about as likely as everyone on the planet spontaneously switching to a more sane kbd layout - there's too much inertia and investment. Bloody hell...
[/off-topic]

apathesis wrote: he best advice is always just to use your ears!

THIS THIS THIS

If it sounds good, then it probably works. If it sounds wack and out of key, and like none of the notes work together... then it pretty much doesn't work
UNLESS you are completely tone deaf, then you're gonna have to REALLY study music theory!

drivebycommenter wrote:[off-topic]For me, personally, the conventions in music theory are even more retarded than the qwerty layout. The twelve-tone equal temperament's good, but why the fuck do we still have to separate it into white and black keys, sharps and flats. Just fuck it away and go with octave/tone numbering. 0/158 or a 0/1-major, for all I care. Just make it a bit more consistent.
But I know it's about as likely as everyone on the planet spontaneously switching to a more sane kbd layout - there's too much inertia and investment. Bloody hell...
[/off-topic]

Can you get an amen? Yes you can, brother.

Why the black keys got to be smaller, and pushed back?

Cause theory's racist, yo

AllNightDayDream wrote:Cause theory's racist, yo

word.