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Why is everyone so quick to jump on the "I don't use sample CDs" bandwagon, when the reality is the majority do.

1) How many people claiming they don't use sample CD's resample elements from tracks on vinyl? The hip hop world was built on samples. Your using someone elses work to recreate something new.

2) How many people have stacks of samples in folders they got from DSF, DOA and torrents? Same thing. Only difference is you didn't pay for them. Probably worse than paying for a sample CD.

I will point one thing out. Sample CD's are only ideal for drum and percussions. The majority of producers are digital, they don't own several drum kits, and lots of percussion instruments (props if you work this way).

There are some that will say you can create drum samples with a synth drum (hardware or software). Yeah you can, but not many do. The sounds you get out of synth drums such as MaschineDrum, ESX etc but they are not the hard hitting snappy snares. With some effort you CAN produce nice drums, but I'm appealing to the majority, usually the ones that complain about samples cds.

The trick is ...

To take samples and create something new. Combine synth instruments with the base snare from a sample cd. Or layer the samples with other samples. Using them straight up (from sample cds or even elements that came with the hardware) is dumb, and that's something that's useless and unoriginal. Using bass, synth samples from sample cds is also stupid.

Resample. Create something new. Whether your samples are from vinyl, or a prepared sample cd, the source of the sample is irrelevant. Creating something new with the sample/samples is where it lies. And whether you chose to admit it or not, you do it, or have done it in the past.

If you disagree, you're lying to yourself. Unless of course you have drum kits and lots of time to play with synth drum machines, in which case, props to you.

I put this up after reading so much hate by obvious noobs on a sample CD review on YouTube. The question is "if you don't use any samples as a base to create something new ... what are you doing".

Some quotes from the said YouTube video:

samples are shit.....i only use vocal loops and the odd drum pattern.....samples takes the fun out of making a song

your a fucking tnuc homophobe. if you buy samples because honestly your a pussy if you cant make your own shit, so if you buy these samples you better go fucking kill yourself and choke on a dick

I don't give a fuck where you got your samples from if the tune is good.
I'm not sure I even care where you got your samples from if the tune is shit!

£10 Bag wrote:I don't give a fuck where you got your samples from if the tune is good.
I'm not sure I even care where you got your samples from if the tune is shit!

^^ Basically.

This is a nice extension of the Morals Of Sampling thread from the other week.

GV1 wrote: Using bass, synth samples from sample cds is also stupid.

even though it's something i don't really do i wouldn't call it stupid if it works for the track. listen to dj shadow entroducing and then listen to some david axelrod and see how he's lifted near enough the whole tune and stuck drums on it in some cases, apparently he's a genius.

when did anyone say this?
i just think it's stupid when people use samples off of x genre they're producing cds unprocessed
like thinking if you go out and buy a sample cd made by reso or something that your tunes are going to sound like his
that and most artist/genre sample cds are nowhere near to the standard of what gets released even by said artist who engineered the sound, most of the time they're all pre processing stuff that most people could come up with on their own, hence a waste of money since people are after the processed sound or how to do it
tl;dr use whatever works for you

£10 Bag wrote:I don't give a fuck where you got your samples from if the tune is good.
I'm not sure I even care where you got your samples from if the tune is shit!

Haha fucking right!

I've bought several sample CDs, and I love them. There is one in particular (not saying which one obv.) which has featured in maybe 15 out of my last 20 projects? Good samples are where you find them, at the end of the day.

I've got a few go-to paid for sample packs and few go-to free samples that get love in 75% of my tunes. Trying to get more into sampling off vinyl and recording my own oddball percussion, just because I personally like those sounds. I will say that I personally find some of the paid samples to be "over processed" in that I have a hard time, personally, tweaking the dynamics with out squashing them. I think using a variety of techniques will keep your sound fresh and your options open.

That said, I've no desire at this point to get into synthesizing ever single drum/percussion sound I use. That seems tedious and unnecessary. I see no reason for it since I tweak each drum sound and additionally use drum bus(es) on most tracks.

symmetricalsounds wrote:

GV1 wrote: Using bass, synth samples from sample cds is also stupid.

even though it's something i don't really do i wouldn't call it stupid if it works for the track. listen to dj shadow entroducing and then listen to some david axelrod and see how he's lifted near enough the whole tune and stuck drums on it in some cases, apparently he's a genius.

Are you saying David ripped off Shadow or vice versa?

Endtroducing was supposed to have been in the Guinness book of world records for being the first album constructed entirely out of samples, though I've also heard there were parts recorded for specifically it? One of my all time favourites anyway, great example of what an art sampling is.

I've noticed that the soil from which hip hop sprang and the soil from which dubstep sprang are opposed ideologically. Hip hop and its emphasis on sampling certainly had socialist elements, whereas the drive to make unique synth sounds and the scepticism regarding samples and presets in dubstep are much more liberal/individualist. Consequences of two different eras? Two different cultures?

cosmic surgeon wrote:Endtroducing was supposed to have been in the Guinness book of world records for being the first album constructed entirely out of samples, though I've also heard there were parts recorded for specifically it? One of my all time favourites anyway, great example of what an art sampling is.

I've noticed that the soil from which hip hop sprang and the soil from which dubstep sprang are opposed ideologically. Hip hop and its emphasis on sampling certainly had socialist elements, whereas the drive to make unique synth sounds and the scepticism regarding samples and presets in dubstep are much more liberal/individualist. Consequences of two different eras? Two different cultures?

Yeah totally two different cultures and eras. But when talking about drum sampling, and the use of drum samples, they are similar.

As for using pre composed synths loops and sounds ... well thats a bit OTT. I'm sure others do it, but it's not for me.

cosmic surgeon wrote:whereas the drive to make unique synth sounds and the scepticism regarding samples and presets in dubstep are much more liberal/individualist.

Not really, there were bare early dubstep tunes that relied heavily on samples with only the bass being synth'ed and it wasn't looked down upon plus 'Burial'.
This whole "I don't sample shit or use presets" is some wank, born out of the brains of bellends who think, because a bass sound took them 4 hours to tune up in massive, it's better than the identical preset that came with massive. This attitude is recent and only really resides on this forum.

Pedro Sánchez wrote:This attitude is recent and only really resides on this forum.

it's being going on since the beginning of sample CD's and it resides on every music production forum.

AJGR wrote:

Pedro Sánchez wrote:This attitude is recent and only really resides on this forum.

it's being going on since the beginning of sample CD's and it resides on every music production forum.

I don't think Dubstep was around at the beginning of sample CD's mate.

the attitude of one's patches being superior to presets...?

lol i have that attitude because i design my patches for lack of a better preset. So there's really no contest.

I'm trying to make music, not fiddle all day with knobs. Knowing how to synth is just as handy when altering a preset to fit your track musically, as it is when starting from scratch.
Just some thoughts. basically as stated above, if your musics good, i don't care how u made it. If your music sucks, i REALLY don't care how you made it.

ChadDub wrote:

symmetricalsounds wrote:

GV1 wrote: Using bass, synth samples from sample cds is also stupid.

even though it's something i don't really do i wouldn't call it stupid if it works for the track. listen to dj shadow entroducing and then listen to some david axelrod and see how he's lifted near enough the whole tune and stuck drums on it in some cases, apparently he's a genius.

Are you saying David ripped off Shadow or vice versa?

dj shadow sampled david axelrod heavily...i'm not cussing him i'm just trying to put into perspective people moaning on one hand about using a bass sample from a sample pack and taking huge chunks out of an existing track and putting drums on it.

not putting down endtroducing before anyone jumps on that one.

I don't see anything wrong with drum samples. Most people don't. If I do use samples for drums instead of synthesis, they are acoustic drums. I don't see much of a point in using electronic drum samples, I can just create my own.

Regarding presets, there is a difference between relying on presets and using one. If I want an 808 kick drum, I'm not going to bother creating one from scratch with synthesis, even though I very well could, I'll just use an 808.

man, i wish i had an 808. These sample packs are great, but that would be cool

I know a lotta producers who don't visit this forum but who have that same attitude. Read an interview with Goldie not too long ago as well where he was lamenting the prevalent understanding of sampling.

Early Mystikz I guess relies on sampling a lot, but as the years have passed the dubstep corpus has expanded beyond that selection of tracks to the point where the majority of producers don't use samples nearly as much. Point taken regarding Burial though.

There are two reasons people diss sample cds...

either

1) they have a problem with sampling full-stop.

2) are ok with sampling, but feel people should dig for their own samples.



I don't really care what other people do.. but for myself, I prefer to dig for my own samples. I am not saying I have never used a sample I didn't rip myself - but rather, the reason I dig for most of my own samples is because sampling itself is part of the enjoyment for me. I love buying shit albums at charity shops to see if I can find anything worth grabbing. I even have a digi recorder hooked up to the TV a lot of the time... just in case.

But for others - I really don't care how they get their sounds. I have yet to hear a shit musician write a good song just because of how or where they got their sounds. And conversely, anyone worth their weight in salt can write well no matter what they use.