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After watching Icicle's masterclass last night I have been thinking about the importance of high quality plugins (effects or generators).

He was saying that he rewires Thor in Reason to Logic bc he is fond of Logic's high quality effects and plugins.

Which really got me thinking...

Is there a big difference in sound quality between say TAL's reverb versus one of Wave's reverb plugin's? Or perhaps NI FM8 versus FL's Sytrus?

No it how you use it not what you use

ehbrums1 wrote:No it how you use it not what you use

That said, you get a lot of shit sounding plugins floating around, especially as freeware.

Not 8-bit sounding shit, but fairly poor audio quality compared to most. You aren't helping yourself by using substandard plugins, and some plugins definitely sound better than others.

Ive never seen what the big deal is with Waves plugs to be honest...... once you get past the pretty GUI and the celebrity producer endorsements they just seem a bit ordinary.

Some freeware stands up well to any bought plug, Camel Crusher is a good example.

JFK wrote:Ive never seen what the big deal is with Waves plugs to be honest...... once you get past the pretty GUI and the celebrity producer endorsements they just seem a bit ordinary.

Some freeware stands up well to any bought plug, Camel Crusher is a good example.

CamelCrusher is the Jesus Christ of plugins

dougriley wrote:After watching Icicle's masterclass last night I have been thinking about the importance of high quality plugins (effects or generators).

He was saying that he rewires Thor in Reason to Logic bc he is fond of Logic's high quality effects and plugins.

Which really got me thinking...

Is there a big difference in sound quality between say TAL's reverb versus one of Wave's reverb plugin's? Or perhaps NI FM8 versus FL's Sytrus?

Sytrus has long been considered superior to FM8, I think you've got that one backwards.

Reason's eq and comp don't really sound that good, imo, and in many others opinions. In fact their filters, and their delays, their mixers, hehehe, don't sound that good. You can try it for yourself. Use a few synths/kong/redrum in reason and bypass any mixer and send their output straight out to reason's output, and run that right into another daw, track that stuff, mix it with even native compressors, limiters, and eq's and then compare it to a mix out of reason, with reason's compressor, limiter, and eq, and see which one you like.

It wouldn't hurt then to also mix those tracks with actual real high quality plugins in a daw, and then you'll really hear a difference.

But a few thoughts: the sound quality is far less important than the actual content of the song. If you're making tracks as good as Icicle's, but you've got that murky reason sound, then maybe you should be worrying about this issue. But if you want to see the biggest gains in your music making, focus on your song writting, that is something to be legitimately fussing over.

And, everyone has a different taste in sound. Some people like super crisp shiny sounds, other people like old rounded dusty sounds. Whatever your preference is.

You've got to figure that out for yourself. When you're in your studio, we're not all going to be there with you, telling you what sounds good, what should be turned up, turned down. You've got to develop your ears, and trust in your own judgements regarding sound. It is the only way.

I think once you come to a point you have mastered your daw/plugins to the point you know what to do and why you are doing it you will have a better understanding of what plugs to add and why to add them.
I only buy what i think i need now and always have a reason for shelling out the money,in an ideal world i would just buy the plugins producers like icicle are using but you will probably find you don't need half of them or never actually use and learn them properly.
Define your own sound using techniques you pick up along the way then your plugins collection will just naturally evolve.

Check out U-He Diva and compare it to an old VA synth. The sound quality is night and day, and when you push the filters you really notice a difference. Personally i find synths like this much more fun to use and the sound seems to be a bit more musical.

That being said, its all about how it sounds in a mix. Some people can make the cheapest synths sing, so as others have said its all about how you use it.

JFK wrote:Some freeware stands up well to any bought plug, Camel Crusher is a good example.

Don't get me wrong, I'm probably the biggest freeware junkie here.

I love freeware, I've got all the VOS stuff, klauhaus, reaplugs, DC1a, Tyrell n6, tal electro & bass, decent bits from the CM Studio etc.

All I'm saying is that it is like mining. You're gonna have to wade through a load of worthless crap to find the real gems.

Worry about getting better at production before you worry about better software and hardware

Thanks for everyone's input!

Let me start off by saying that I am far from mastering the stock generators and effects. However, I'm always looking for ways to improve the sound quality in my work. I understand quality can not be bought. Watching this masterclass merely just sparked some interest in what tools I'm actually using to achieve my goals.

waves are over rated, however stuff like uad, urs, oxford are not

There are some legit waves plugs, don't deny. As a general proposition, I think it is kind of crazy though.

deadly habit wrote:waves are over rated, however stuff like uad, urs, oxford are not

Waves api collection is worth it though,i have read many places that api2500 compressor is the closest anyone has got to its hardware counterpart.

Waves + TDM = Those one knob plugins are jokes though.

nowaysj wrote:There are some legit waves plugs, don't deny. As a general proposition, I think it is kind of crazy though.

oh no doubt, anyone who buys the diamond or mercury etc is nuts

Waves diamond/mercury bundles=more money than sense

waves are only name and marketing, they are now easily surpassed by the likes of u-he and fabfilter
don't believe the hype!!

nowaysj wrote: You've got to figure that out for yourself. When you're in your studio, we're not all going to be there with you, telling you what sounds good, what should be turned up, turned down. You've got to develop your ears, and trust in your own judgements regarding sound. It is the only way.

quoted for truth, and probably the absolute best peice of advice to give on most threads in most production forums.....but then production forums would be pretty boring if that was the only answer to everytihng huh? lol

nothings ever gonna beat taking the time to learn/do it your self.

as far as the question at hand imo yes there can be huge difference in quality between plugs, but sometimes the one you think is shitty works really well for one thing but not another, trial and error is the only way to know what you like.

Yes, there's tremendous quality difference between plugins.