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Like it says on the tin. going through a major dry spell. i used to be making like 3 tunes a day in renoise - been working in ableton live lately, and I dig it, but the workflow is slower than renoise for sure.

any recommendations on getting back into it? i was thinking a shit tune a day until i clear out the cobwebs.

I don't believe in inspiration - if you haven't read "the war of art" i highly recommend it - as i've learned "the muse favors the working stiff". regardless, i feel like my sample library is too big - i've scaled back on any "try before you buy" vsts i've installed so i'm mostly back to the basics.

I think the real problem is lack of vision - i've been listening to a lot of techno, houndstooth, gessafelstein/bromance, and old industrial lately - i wanna take my tunes in that direction - but it seems like i'm kinda puttin the pussy on a pedestal - like making it out to be a bigger deal to produce than it really is.

anyone ever have issues where they weren't finishing tunes because they were caring too much about them? my best shit always came about when i didn't care, and just had fun.

help me be less serious!

That sucks. I'm going through a bit of a dry spell myself. When I was still at uni i had a proper routine going, (wake up, have a spliff and wait for magic to happen) and I was making at least one quality tune a week but now i have a job and a girlfriend I just don't have the time anymore haha. Or whenever i do have the time i've got no mojo.

why not try limiting your self in the extreme. I'm pretty sure extrawelt made 'schoene neue extrawelt' entirely out of resampled 808's. A similar challenge might focus you.

Come on guys. No excuses. I am teaching three college courses and working retail three days a week and I still find time to write music and find creative energy. Yes I also have a girlfriend and a life. Cut out the TV and mindless partying ;p

misk wrote:anyone ever have issues where they weren't finishing tunes because they were caring too much about them? my best shit always came about when i didn't care, and just had fun.

help me be less serious!

I don't know if people are aware of Misk's quality of work. It is high.

Misk, you're going to get through it bro, we both know it. You want a shortcut through the desert?

In regards to upping your production quality (which for you is fairly crazy), I don't think it can be faked. The level of quality needs to be there in your workflow. You can't have your workflow, and then like extra sessions of quality on top of that. (well you can, but roll with me) There are too many decisions in the process, those decisions need to be right, right when they are made. They need to be what you want, and translatable on playback systems. So when you are just breezing through a tune, not caring - that level of decision making needs to rise, not the afterwards. So as you step up to the next level, that easy breazy production flow is going to be interrupted, and when it is interrupted, the magic is not going to happen, the spark is not going to take. No ifs, ands, or buts. But once you've internalized this new level of quality, of care, of listening, of problem solving, it will be easy breezy and tunes will just flow out effortlessly again.

Well, if you can step up to the next level. If you can care enough, if you can sweat it out enough. You do need to get to that place though, that flowing place.

I've been listening to your music for years, and I've always felt that your work is slightly derivative. Maybe overly referential. I don't know. I don't want you to get the wrong idea. I'm here: . You're here: 0 But I always want more from you. More of your unique vision. Your work is always inventive, interesting, well produced, but I want more. I want the next step, I want you to find your voice as an artist. To really get there. Like the next step for you is it. It is like you will have completely arrived. That is what is waiting for you just up there. I really think you are there. Keep working, get back to that flowy place, with your new level of quality (which again, is hard for me to even imagine).

In summary: I don't think being less serious is the answer for you right now. Putting in the work and getting that new level of skill to be effortless is where you are at. Then you can be less serious again.

I really can't wait to hear more in the future.



Oh, and feel free to visit the TUNA! thread. About five people right now, submitting tracks on a weekly basis, just working through whatever we're working through. It'd be incredible if you joined us. Set up an alternate sc for wips. Studio kind of workshop thing. That goes for anybody else that is reading this thread. If you are at that place where you can produce a track a week, come on down to the basement. We're all experiencing gains in strength. Come down to the basement and sweat with the bros.

I feel you bro. To a T.
Been contemplating forcing shitty songs as well to reinforce a workflow methodology like noway's saying. Grind out a bunch of B-sides without getting too attached and maybe you'll internalize your process to the degree that you can get back to purely intuitive creation. Should help with the pussy pedestal issue as well.

It's really just down to laying out a solid routine and putting in the work. That's kind of a meta theme for success. If I could draw up a daily schedule and stick closely to it, after a few months of grinding everything would get easier and the results would skyrocket.

Tuna definitely seems like a viable solution. The workout metaphor is quite fitting actually. Working on strengthening the raw essentials to improve performance in a scenario that actually matters. Come game day, the more work you've put in prior, the better your results.

less talk, more walk

nowaysj wrote:
I don't know if people are aware of Misk's quality of work. It is high.

I'm humbled. don't know what else to say. thank you.

nowaysj wrote: Misk, you're going to get through it bro, we both know it. You want a shortcut through the desert?

In regards to upping your production quality (which for you is fairly crazy), I don't think it can be faked. The level of quality needs to be there in your workflow. You can't have your workflow, and then like extra sessions of quality on top of that. (well you can, but roll with me) There are too many decisions in the process, those decisions need to be right, right when they are made. They need to be what you want, and translatable on playback systems. So when you are just breezing through a tune, not caring - that level of decision making needs to rise, not the afterwards. So as you step up to the next level, that easy breazy production flow is going to be interrupted, and when it is interrupted, the magic is not going to happen, the spark is not going to take. No ifs, ands, or buts. But once you've internalized this new level of quality, of care, of listening, of problem solving, it will be easy breezy and tunes will just flow out effortlessly again.

This seems obvious, now that i've read it — thus, damn good advice.

nowaysj wrote: I've been listening to your music for years, and I've always felt that your work is slightly derivative. Maybe overly referential. I don't know. I don't want you to get the wrong idea. I'm here: . You're here: 0 But I always want more from you. More of your unique vision. Your work is always inventive, interesting, well produced, but I want more. I want the next step, I want you to find your voice as an artist. To really get there. Like the next step for you is it. It is like you will have completely arrived. That is what is waiting for you just up there. I really think you are there. Keep working, get back to that flowy place, with your new level of quality (which again, is hard for me to even imagine).

I really can't wait to hear more in the future.

wow, you really know me too well. thats exactly how i've felt about my work, as well as where I want to be. Like my own voice is pushing through and I'm almost at odds with the natural progression. I really appreciate you taking the time to engage with my problem on a personal level (well i mean, this IS the internet, as personal as can be).

seriously - you hit the nail so hard on the head, i'm thinking of looking out my window to see if you've been watching me

Producing, and developing the technical skills has always been rewarding for me, but finding a voice, or feeling like you have something to say that people actually feel is worth listening to - that's facing a fear head on like a massive dragon.

Sounds like it's time to just let it flow a bit more - release constraints, and keep the nose to the grindstone. thanks again, man.

SunkLo wrote:I feel you bro. To a T.
Been contemplating forcing shitty songs as well to reinforce a workflow methodology like noway's saying. Grind out a bunch of B-sides without getting too attached and maybe you'll internalize your process to the degree that you can get back to purely intuitive creation. Should help with the pussy pedestal issue as well.

It's really just down to laying out a solid routine and putting in the work. That's kind of a meta theme for success. If I could draw up a daily schedule and stick closely to it, after a few months of grinding everything would get easier and the results would skyrocket.

Tuna definitely seems like a viable solution. The workout metaphor is quite fitting actually. Working on strengthening the raw essentials to improve performance in a scenario that actually matters. Come game day, the more work you've put in prior, the better your results.

reading a REALLY dope book right now called Artist's Routines - all about the daily routines of many famous writers, philosophers, artists, and composers. VERY interesting. The one common thread i find particularly hilarious is many of the artists prior to around 1900 "start the day with amphetamines and end with sleeping pills".

misk wrote:"start the day with amphetamines and end with sleeping pills".

Iiiiiimagine that.

misk wrote:i'm thinking of looking out my window to see if you've been watching me

Oh, I've been watching.

well if you are, then I hope you brought your parka. cold as fuck right now.

and my dog needed to do that whole "wake up! I'm gonna act like i need to pee but i really just wanna sniff around outside till your hands are numb!" thing. niiiiice.

In cali now. You know how it goes.

yup. if you're not careful, it may even drop below 60!

haha, it's 18 in brooklyn.

Why would you use a workstation that effectively keeps you from making music?

I see what you mean in a lack of vision, I think it's a personal vision. What music do you want to make, and how are you able to make it. It seems like Renoise was your best tool, and dropping it for some other daw (presumably for the big names that use it) is a pretty bum move man.
I remember when I started working with DAWs other than FL, and I expected them to make my music better, but they won't. Only the decisions you make from the mouse and keyboard end of your computer can make a difference.


If Burial, believe me no pressure, made it to national headlines with SoundForge, I recon you can do it with Renoise.

Good luck.





Imagine if [insert band/artist name] switched to [insert irrelevant instrument name] half way through their ascent.

jesslem wrote:Why would you use a workstation that effectively keeps you from making music?

I see what you mean in a lack of vision, I think it's a personal vision. What music do you want to make, and how are you able to make it. It seems like Renoise was your best tool, and dropping it for some other daw (presumably for the big names that use it) is a pretty bum move man.
I remember when I started working with DAWs other than FL, and I expected them to make my music better, but they won't. Only the decisions you make from the mouse and keyboard end of your computer can make a difference.


If Burial, believe me no pressure, made it to national headlines with SoundForge, I recon you can do it with Renoise.

Good luck.

it's more than just changing DAWs. I did it for multiple reasons, first of all, i've been through them all - Cubase, Logic, ProTools, Live (1.0 Demo) Reason - and then Renoise. You can DEFINITELY make amazing music with Renoise if that's your goal - it's in no way handicapped - on the contrary, most other DAWs are handicapped in comparison, for a long list of reasons (pun).

I chose live for a few reasons - I've been performing live with it for a while now; 9.0 suite included max for live, and I LOVE working with max/msp; and I got to a point with renoise (see the renoise - whats so damn good about it thread) where I was pretty much able to read the patterns of my own tunes like notation, thus making the process much more visual for me than I wanted it to be.

Working with Live has improved my arrangements - primarily due to the pattern mentality i would get myself into in renoise. Now I use both, and "the big names use it" has never had anything to do with my choice of tool. If i was a carpenter and I needed a radial saw, I wouldn't get the makita if thats what I heard everyone was using, if the milwaukee was better - I've been over that bs for years

Add to this the fact that I dropped cash on Live 9, and when I buy something, I copy the manual to my ipad and read it every night like it's the bible. I'm the poster-boy for RTFM really. When I invest money into something, I want to make sure I can get the most out of it. I'm at the point that if I chose to get a plane ticket to Berlin, I could probably be ableton certified - but that's not my goal.

Pardon the digression, but the reality is, I changed my tools because i got so used to my current tool (renoise) that I found myself thinking within a very limited box. for me moving between the two has proven to be very effective in the past - and rewiring renoise to live? even better.

Working between daws is positive for me as well. I find it to be difficult and annoying, but something about that process makes the songs better. Maybe just because I have to care more.

it shakes up your workflow just enough to allow you to kinda think outside your regular box

I also agree on the DAW switchup idea. Reshuffles your cards for you.

I'll check out that book, although that quote sort of says it all. Sounds like the hook from a trap anthem. Maybe the right drugs would help. Herb always seems to provoke that vibe state where you're really motivated to keep pushing a track but it also tends to alter critical perception. (The two are probably linked, less criticism, more flow)

If I could have that drive without losing my head a bit, it'd be perfect. Not just with music production but a lot of other areas too. Maybe Modafinil or something similar... Another 'racetam perhaps. To the smart drugs thread!

fragments wrote:Cut out the TV and mindless partying ;p

no

I personally think the workflow is good in Ableton.