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On BBC2 tonight at 9PM:-

9/11: The Conspiracy Files - Examining the growing number of theories
surrounding the terrorist attacks.

Parson wrote:its very hard to make a building fall like a demolition

it doesn't happen by accident

Any buildings over a certain height are usually designed to fall inward by the architect. If they fell over sideways, they'd cause far more damage to surrounding buildings.

Worth reading this article by George Monbiot http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... 31,00.html. But then again if folks are already convinced one way they'll probably just think he's some fifth columnist undermining the "truth".

If anyone does come up with an argument against a conspiracy this is usually how it's seen anyway. Which is why I don't bother with conspiracy theories any more.

From the article

"The failure of the twin towers has been exhaustively documented by the National Institute of Standards and Technology. Far from being impossible, the collapse turns out to have been inevitable. The planes cut some of the support columns and ignited fires sufficient to weaken (but not melt) the remaining steel structures. As the perimeter columns buckled, the weight of the collapsing top stories generated a momentum the rest of the building could not arrest. Puffs of smoke were blown out of the structure by compression as the building fell.

Counterpunch, the radical leftwing magazine, commissioned its own expert - an aerospace and mechanical engineer - to test the official findings. He shows that the institute must have been right. He also demonstrates how Building 7 collapsed. Burning debris falling from the twin towers ruptured the oil pipes feeding its emergency generators. The reduction in pressure triggered the automatic pumping system, which poured thousands of gallons of diesel on to the fire. The support trusses weakened and buckled, and the building imploded. Popular Mechanics magazine polled 300 experts and came to the same conclusions."

never heard of this loose change thing you keep talkin bout

ah right...its a pretty famous documentry all about the 9/11 attacks and how it was an inside job etc..its actually what David Lynch is talking about it the clip you posted

"The clip is from a show called Wereldgasten (world guests)on Dutch TV, thats a few hours long with one guest per episode. That guest talks about all kinds of clips he/she requested. This clip that David Lynch requested here came from Loose Change."

a lot of the stuff he talks about here for me was just proven to be rubbish by the counter documentry, screw loose change.

well regardless of loose change or screw loose change, i still believe that the people who benefitted from it most are the neocons

i believe state sponsored terrorism is their best tool to create a fear-soaked population lining up for liberty erosion

Parson wrote:well regardless of loose change or screw loose change, i still believe that the people who benefitted from it most are the neocons

its definatley one of the things that has kept me interested and intrigued by 9/11, but i dont think its fair to say that because certain groups of people have benefited, that they should then be seen as guilty.

i mean if for a minute you believed that it was terrorists and not an inside job then its the same outcome anyway....it gos no way to prove your right, it just says to me that the goverment will squeeze every situation for the most they can get out of it.

Parson wrote:i believe state sponsored terrorism is their best tool to create a fear-soaked population lining up for liberty erosion

im more worried on how they've used it to fuel the so called "war on terror", thats the bullshit there, not "liberty erosion" in America.

Shonky wrote:

Parson wrote:its very hard to make a building fall like a demolition

it doesn't happen by accident

Any buildings over a certain height are usually designed to fall inward by the architect. If they fell over sideways, they'd cause far more damage to surrounding buildings.

Worth reading this article by George Monbiot http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... 31,00.html. But then again if folks are already convinced one way they'll probably just think he's some fifth columnist undermining the "truth".

If anyone does come up with an argument against a conspiracy this is usually how it's seen anyway. Which is why I don't bother with conspiracy theories any more.

From the article

"The failure of the twin towers has been exhaustively documented by the National Institute of Standards and Technology. Far from being impossible, the collapse turns out to have been inevitable. The planes cut some of the support columns and ignited fires sufficient to weaken (but not melt) the remaining steel structures. As the perimeter columns buckled, the weight of the collapsing top stories generated a momentum the rest of the building could not arrest. Puffs of smoke were blown out of the structure by compression as the building fell.

Counterpunch, the radical leftwing magazine, commissioned its own expert - an aerospace and mechanical engineer - to test the official findings. He shows that the institute must have been right. He also demonstrates how Building 7 collapsed. Burning debris falling from the twin towers ruptured the oil pipes feeding its emergency generators. The reduction in pressure triggered the automatic pumping system, which poured thousands of gallons of diesel on to the fire. The support trusses weakened and buckled, and the building imploded. Popular Mechanics magazine polled 300 experts and came to the same conclusions."

nice 1, interesting read.

yeah the war on terror, liberty erosion, whatever

state sponsored terrorism is real

its not new, its not wacky, its not a big secret, and its very obvious

and bush is a pawn who is not kept in the loop

Parson wrote:i think people who trust the governent enough to srsly doubt it was an inside job are the nutters

yes. & for anyone that believes the 'official' story I've got some AMAZING investment oppurtunities to disscuss with you >>>

doomstep wrote:

Parson wrote:i think people who trust the governent enough to srsly doubt it was an inside job are the nutters

yes. & for anyone that believes the 'official' story I've got some AMAZING investment oppurtunities to disscuss with you >>>

and u believe in what exactly? the "unofficial story" told to you by who exactly, some mad conspiracy theorist who will tell u there was no moon landing, no holocaust and that "illuminati" are takin over the world!, im exagarating but do ya know what i mean??!?! think about who your gettin your info from!

as ive said before i dont really know who or what to believe, but dont think you're gettin anything closer to the truth by listening to fools broadcasting there slant on current affairs on some conspiracy website.

Bob Crunkhouse wrote:

doomstep wrote:

Parson wrote:i think people who trust the governent enough to srsly doubt it was an inside job are the nutters

yes. & for anyone that believes the 'official' story I've got some AMAZING investment oppurtunities to disscuss with you >>>

and u believe in what exactly? the "unofficial story" told to you by who exactly, some mad conspiracy theorist who will tell u there was no moon landing, no holocaust and that "illuminati" are takin over the world!, im exagarating but do ya know what i mean??!?! think about who your gettin your info from!

where the fuck exactlly did I say that ?!?

just becasue I dont believe one story dont inherantlly mean I do the other yh

I werent there so really my perspective aint worth shit - no matter how many hours I spend on google video.

& the only people I'm innarested in hearin from are people wot where on the ground when it happened - unedited & in full without the opinions of 'experts'

Bob Crunkhouse wrote: as ive said before i dont really know who or what to believe, but dont think you're gettin anything closer to the truth by listening to fools broadcasting there slant on current affairs on some conspiracy website.

let go of the ideal of 'the truth' & yr one step closer

goon

illuminati are not taking over the world

they been running shit for hundreds of years and possibly longer

During the summer of 1798, Rev. G. W. Snyder, a Lutheran minister, wrote a letter to President Washington and included a copy of Robison’s book, expressing his concern about the Illuminati infiltrating the American Masonic lodges. In Washington’s response, dated September 25, 1798, he wrote: “I have heard much about the nefarious and dangerous plan and doctrines of the Illuminati,” but went on to say that he didn’t believe that they had become involved in the lodges. A subsequent letter by Snyder, requesting a more reassuring answer, resulted in a letter from Washington, dated October 24, 1798, which can be found in The Writings of George Washington (volume 20, page 518, which was prepared under the direction of the U.S. George Washington Bicentennial Commission and published by the U.S. Government Printing Office in 1941). He wrote:

“It was not my intention to doubt that the doctrines of the Illuminati and the principles of Jacobinism had not spread in the United States. On the contrary, no one is more satisfied of this fact than I am. The idea I meant to convey, was, that I did not believe that the lodges of Freemasons in this country had, as societies, endeavored to propagate the diabolical tenets of the first, or pernicious principles of the latter. That individuals of them may have done it, or that the founder or instruments employed to have found the democratic societies in the United States may have had this object, and actually had a separation of the people from their government in view, is too evident to be questioned.”

Shortly before his death, Washington issued two more warnings about the Illuminati.

Around 1807, John Quincy Adams (said to have organized the New England Masonic lodges), who later became President in 1825, wrote three letters to Colonel William C. Stone, a top Mason, telling him that Thomas Jefferson, our 3rd President, and founder of the Democratic Party, was using the Masonic lodges for subversive Illuminati purposes. These letters were allegedly kept at the Rittenburg Square Library in Philadelphia, but have mysteriously vanished. Adams also wrote to Washington, saying that Jefferson and Alexander Hamilton were misusing Masonic lodges for Illuminati purposes and the worship of Lucifer (which is recorded in the Adams Chronicles).

Benjamin Franklin was also accused of being a member of the Illuminati, but there is no concrete proof of this. Jefferson seemed to be the main focus of everyone’s ire. He was accused by the Federalists of being a Jacobin, and an atheist. There is some evidence to indicate that he did use the Democratic Societies and Jacobin Clubs in his 1796 battle with John Adams for the Presidency. The Rev. Jedediah Morse identified Jefferson as “an Illuminatus.”

"Those who represent an ideal beyond the comprehension of the masses must face the persecution of the unthinking multitude who are without the divine idealism which inspires progress and those rational faculties which unerringly sift truth from falsehood."
-Manly Palmer Hall

Churchill said, a lot of people will one day in their life trip over the truth. But most just get up dust themselves off and continue as if nothing has happened.

ohh that was a good post for 11:11

reminds me of this post:
At 12/2/06 9:31 PM, Sebastian said...

I'm wondering about this number 11.
Our "dial 911 for emergency" 9+1+1=11
Manhattan Island "discovered" by Henry Hudson (11 letters) 9-11-1609
American flag used in battle 1st time 9-11-1777
Construction of "The Pentagon"(11letters) begins 9-11-1941
11 Israeli Olympic atheletes killed in terrorist attack 9-11-1972
Bush Sr. announces NWO 9-11-1990
6,000th anniversary of Adam's creation according to Hebrew scriptures 9-11-1999
WTC disaster 9-11-2001
Mohammed's birth celebrated on 11th day of 9th month
119 area code to Iraq/Iran (I./I.) 2 I's - 9th letter
twin towers make an 11
1st plane to hit towers, Flight 11 had 11 crew members (2 pilots, 9 flight attendants), 92 passengers (9+2=11)
Flight 11 call letters: AA11, i.e., 1,1,11
New York: 11th state
New York City: 11 letters
...etc... I found the 9/11 & 11's list goes on and on and on- just with a quick google search

I don't understand numerology very well yet, but I've seen 11 called the "master number," "number of high magick," and referred to as the twins in eternal war. This is

!!

just now as i was writing this, i was taping a David Icke talk and the tape ran out, so I bent down to turn the tape over, and the innacurate digi clock on the stereo said 11:11 !
Holy shit.

Parson wrote:ohh that was a good post for 11:11

reminds me of this post:
At 12/2/06 9:31 PM, Sebastian said...

I'm wondering about this number 11.
Our "dial 911 for emergency" 9+1+1=11
Manhattan Island "discovered" by Henry Hudson (11 letters) 9-11-1609
American flag used in battle 1st time 9-11-1777
Construction of "The Pentagon"(11letters) begins 9-11-1941
11 Israeli Olympic atheletes killed in terrorist attack 9-11-1972
Bush Sr. announces NWO 9-11-1990
6,000th anniversary of Adam's creation according to Hebrew scriptures 9-11-1999
WTC disaster 9-11-2001
Mohammed's birth celebrated on 11th day of 9th month
119 area code to Iraq/Iran (I./I.) 2 I's - 9th letter
twin towers make an 11
1st plane to hit towers, Flight 11 had 11 crew members (2 pilots, 9 flight attendants), 92 passengers (9+2=11)
Flight 11 call letters: AA11, i.e., 1,1,11
New York: 11th state
New York City: 11 letters
...etc... I found the 9/11 & 11's list goes on and on and on- just with a quick google search

I don't understand numerology very well yet, but I've seen 11 called the "master number," "number of high magick," and referred to as the twins in eternal war. This is

!!

just now as i was writing this, i was taping a David Icke talk and the tape ran out, so I bent down to turn the tape over, and the innacurate digi clock on the stereo said 11:11 !
Holy shit.

Make a wish!

doomstep wrote:

Bob Crunkhouse wrote:

doomstep wrote:

Parson wrote:i think people who trust the governent enough to srsly doubt it was an inside job are the nutters

yes. & for anyone that believes the 'official' story I've got some AMAZING investment oppurtunities to disscuss with you >>>

and u believe in what exactly? the "unofficial story" told to you by who exactly, some mad conspiracy theorist who will tell u there was no moon landing, no holocaust and that "illuminati" are takin over the world!, im exagarating but do ya know what i mean??!?! think about who your gettin your info from!

where the fuck exactlly did I say that ?!?

just becasue I dont believe one story dont inherantlly mean I do the other yh

I werent there so really my perspective aint worth shit - no matter how many hours I spend on google video.

& the only people I'm innarested in hearin from are people wot where on the ground when it happened - unedited & in full without the opinions of 'experts'

Bob Crunkhouse wrote: as ive said before i dont really know who or what to believe, but dont think you're gettin anything closer to the truth by listening to fools broadcasting there slant on current affairs on some conspiracy website.

let go of the ideal of 'the truth' & yr one step closer

goon

the first thing i wrote was actually, "and u believe in what exactly?", i then went with what most of the conspiracy theorists say to me, apoligies if you arent in that camp, and base your information on better sources.

Parson wrote:ohh that was a good post for 11:11

reminds me of this post:
At 12/2/06 9:31 PM, Sebastian said...

I'm wondering about this number 11.
Our "dial 911 for emergency" 9+1+1=11
Manhattan Island "discovered" by Henry Hudson (11 letters) 9-11-1609
American flag used in battle 1st time 9-11-1777
Construction of "The Pentagon"(11letters) begins 9-11-1941
11 Israeli Olympic atheletes killed in terrorist attack 9-11-1972
Bush Sr. announces NWO 9-11-1990
6,000th anniversary of Adam's creation according to Hebrew scriptures 9-11-1999
WTC disaster 9-11-2001
Mohammed's birth celebrated on 11th day of 9th month
119 area code to Iraq/Iran (I./I.) 2 I's - 9th letter
twin towers make an 11
1st plane to hit towers, Flight 11 had 11 crew members (2 pilots, 9 flight attendants), 92 passengers (9+2=11)
Flight 11 call letters: AA11, i.e., 1,1,11
New York: 11th state
New York City: 11 letters
...etc... I found the 9/11 & 11's list goes on and on and on- just with a quick google search.

Yeah, but a lot of stuff happens on dates that have nothing to do with the number 11. In fact, given that we only have 12 months in a year, and years are only displayed with 4 digits, it would be weird if something didn't happen on a date with the number 11 in it.

I don't buy this numerology shit.