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Trainrek wrote:If you don't have a problem with this then I have a problem with you. Who cares if its private property, its easy to say that when you have a fucking roof over your head.
There are enough empty homes in Europe to house the entire homeless population twice over.
Then you get cruel stnuc doing barbaric shit like this, and now sleeping rough is even rougher.
Like kidshuffle said spend the money on creating shelter and the problem wouldn't exist in the first place.

"The measure of a civilization is how it treats its weakest members."

So I'm assuming you have built a little shelter next to your front door or took in a homeless person yourself? Or are only other people supposed to solve things that you believe are a problem?

Yeah, what if there was a homeless person that slept on your doorstep every night trainrek? Would you be fine with that?

If it happened more than once I'd probably offer him a sandwich, cup of tea and a shower at the very least.

Well yeah to begin with you would but what about after a month? a year? what if you want to try and sell the house?

wub wrote:If it happened more than once I'd probably offer him a sandwich, cup of tea and a shower at the very least.

Yeah right. You'd probably open the door angrily wearing a Ralph Lauren turtle neck polo shirt, with a glass of 1987 Shiraz wine in one hand, and a tazer in the other hand.

Speaking purely of the west, I think there are more people who take issue with homelessness, who have a spare room or couch, than there are homeless people.

Genevieve wrote:Speaking purely of the west, I think there are more people who take issue with homelessness, who have a spare room or couch, than there are homeless people.

They'd still be homeless just as the homeless who reside in shelters remain homeless.

There was a tramp who 'lived' in a bus stop right outside of this girl i was seeing's house last year. He was there almost every time i went past and always said hello but never asked for anything, eventually the girls flatmates invited him in, gave him a cup of tea and let him shower, he told them all about how he used to be in the army and how he became homeless.

After that no-one saw him for a couple of weeks and then one time i walked past he was there and mumbled something at me, i stopped and he handed me a pack of antibiotics and asked me to get some out for him as he had only like 3 fingers, I of course did. He seemed pretty worse for wear but i assumed he was just drunk as he was an alcoholic. Then a few days later there was news that a tramp had died of a heart attack just down the road and we eventually found out it was him .

RIP stumpy.

scspkr99 wrote:

Genevieve wrote:Speaking purely of the west, I think there are more people who take issue with homelessness, who have a spare room or couch, than there are homeless people.

They'd still be homeless just as the homeless who reside in shelters remain homeless.

Is it about what they're titled or about having roofs over their heads? It could also be the first step to a better life. Getting cleaned up and healthy makes job hunting easier.

Should people just stand there and criticize others for not building them homes if they can give them a roof and a warm bed? Or in other words, should the biggest loudmouth do nothing because someone else isn't doing everything?

scspkr99 wrote:

Genevieve wrote:Speaking purely of the west, I think there are more people who take issue with homelessness, who have a spare room or couch, than there are homeless people.

They'd still be homeless just as the homeless who reside in shelters remain homeless.

Nah, If you tell them they're still homeless when you go out of your way to give them a place to live you're a tnuc imo.

m8son wrote:
RIP stumpy.

Life is so unfair and jokes. RIP Stumpy

I lived in Osaka's Nishinari district for two months, it's the fucking ghetto of the whole of Japan. Every time I came out my door there'd be someone pissing in the street, or sleeping in someone's piss from the day before. Ambulances down every night, people rolling around on the floor pissed and/or dying in the street. Street corners busy with people stripping the shit out of old electronics to get the metal out, guys going round with big long carts piled with cans and cardboard to sell for recycling. The day labour centre had a queue a mile long, before it opened at 8am from even 4am the street next to it would be full of people hawking stolen stuff or anything thrown away. Gangster offices, brothels, dealers and all kinds of shady shit every-fucking-where, even stories of homeless guys being kidnapped to work at the Fukushima plant.

No-one ever asked me for money, not even once. The worst thing that happened was one guy said "Hello!" to me regularly, in a friendly way. The police were actually more on it than anyone, three snuck up from behind and surrounded me while they questioned me why I was there - this was the first time I left the fucking house after getting there.

The worst thing was I couldn't help anyone because it might have freaked them out or thought I was trying to rob them. Other people could see the people drunk or dying so I just had to leave them there. It's fucking weird watching that shit, some Japanese people say "It's not Japan!" but it is, they just don't want to accept it. At least the UK has a semi-decent safety net, but we need to work on it (Basic Guaranteed Income imho).

East Anglia tbf.

Genevieve wrote: Is it about what they're titled or about having roofs over their heads? It could also be the first step to a better life. Getting cleaned up and healthy makes job hunting easier.

Neither it merely means that having a roof over your head isn't the same as having a home, just as a friend giving me a lift to work isn't the same as me having a car.

scspkr99 wrote:

Genevieve wrote: Is it about what they're titled or about having roofs over their heads? It could also be the first step to a better life. Getting cleaned up and healthy makes job hunting easier.

Neither it merely means that having a roof over your head isn't the same as having a home, just as a friend giving me a lift to work isn't the same as me having a car.

So having a person with no food, no ability to wash himself and no place to sleep, offering that person this nightly, is not an improvement of their situation? And it's better to tell people who don't care to build them houses, than it is for yourself, a person that cares, to help them to the best of your abilities?

Genevieve wrote: So having a person with no food, no ability to wash himself and no place to sleep, offering that person this nightly, is not an improvement of their situation? And it's better to tell people who don't care to build them houses, than it is for yourself, a person that cares, to help them to the best of your abilities?

You really don't understand homelessness, you ignore that very few homeless people need go hungry, that they can remain homeless despite having access to temporary accommodation and that there are reasons they end up homeless that aren't addressed by someone offering them a couch.

Now usually your positions are well argued irrespective of me disagreeing with them, here they just aren't so I'm swerving it.

What? So are you saying that the situation Genevieve gave is no better than someone sleeping on the streets every night? I know which i would prefer

My partner has worked on homeless services for 15 years, there are in among that group many homeless sleepers that choose to sleep rough, sleeping rough and being homeless aren't the same.

And I apologise for the particularly shit appeal to authority but you don't really get homelessness. Nor do I think you're bothered by this thinking that people who are opposed to these spikes should offer someone a bed.

scspkr99 wrote:you don't really get homelessness.

go on then explain it to me

scspkr99 wrote:You really don't understand homelessness, you ignore that very few homeless people need go hungry, that they can remain homeless despite having access to temporary accommodation and that there are reasons they end up homeless that aren't addressed by someone offering them a couch.

No not at all. I'm pointing out the double standard in those calling how fucked up these spikes are who then wouldn't want a homeless person near them and aren't even offering them all the help that they could give them.

Of course offering someone a roof over their heads doesn't end the issue of homelesness. But it does help a homeless person. It helps a homeless person more than installing spikes does. That's what I've been saying all along; you can't demand others to fix the problem if you yourself aren't willing to help with anything at all. Individuals may not be able to end homelesness, but they sure as fuck could improve the quality of the lives of many homeless people. I feel like you're avoiding this.